Harrells FL die modification.

Alinwa,, I think the belief that seating below sized area is bad
comes from another place, Not BR. Those that load 223's and 243's
with lots of air space and neck sizing on the short side have had
bullets drop down in the case, especially when carried in the pocket.
Normally this is not the case with the 30 BR. That said, the 30BR
has a sufficient neck length even with zero freebore. Some dies
have been made to size very short. Necks turned to thin may also
cause this. Given the normal configureation of the 30 BR, something
is off
 
Bob Kingsbury

The idea that seating a bullet below the sized area on the neck is "bad" comes from Mike Ratigans book...He covers that issue in great detail..
 
eww1350 said:
The idea that seating a bullet below the sized area on the neck is "bad" comes from Mike Ratigans book...He covers that issue in great detail..
Click to expand...

I thought Mr. Ratigan shot a PPC. We are talking 30BR here,lotta things that you wouldn't do with a PPC work very well in the 30.
 
I think asking some others at a match is a good idea. I also will be seeing my smith about another rifle soon. I'm going to show him whatI've got going on too and see what he says too. Thank you for all your input gentlemen.
 
With a FB custom bullet, such as is commonly used in short range Benchrest, is positioned in a sized neck so that the base of the bullet is within the sized portion, the pressure ring sort of interlocks with the neck which forms around it. Also, the step in the neck where the base of the bullet rests against the unsized part of the neck increases the pressure needed to push the bullet farther into the case. These features may not be important with powders that do not "require" relatively high neck tension, or bullets with ogive shapes that do not shoot their best near jam, but with the combination that I commonly shoot (133 with a double radius ogive bullet) it helps to have the heel of the bullet in the sized portion of the neck to increase the force needed to push the bullet farther back in the case as the bolt is closed, increasing the maximum OAL at jam.

In the past, I have seated bullets past the sized portion of the neck and as the pressure ring passed out of the sized part, the bullet became easier to push.
 
? for Larry...

Hi Larry.

How much of the length of the case neck does the bushing size? Take a black Sharpie, color the entire length of the neck, run the case into the die and through a bushing, measure how far down the neck the bushing has worn the Sharpie off and post your findings, okay?

Maybe others using the Harrel 30BR dies could also post this info. Then, Larry could see if his die is on par with what others are getting. -Al
 
I haven't seen the die but

Any good machinist should be able to make the pocket the bushing sits in deeper thus allowing the neck to be sized deeper. I am all for sizing the whole danged neck; why not? they are gonna get hard anyway and need to be annealed even if one only sizes 1/3 of it. another way out of this is to have some freebore put into the next reamer you buy. .020 would give one a lot more latitude in which bullets one is easily able to use.
 
Measuring something like this isn't super precise, but mine sizes .231-.233 as best I can tell. The whole case measures 1.510 and a longer case would obviously have more of the neck sized.
 
While we're here...

and mentioning the neck "seal"...

I think the neck seals from the shoulder forward. Indication of that is the soot found somewhat forward of the shoulder and getting blacker toward the mouth of the case. It must seal rather quickly or more of the case would be "sooty".
 
I was shooting a very contemptable 6BR today. With .005 jump, I had
soot on shoulders, jamed fixed that. No more black shoulders. Even
H4198 doesn't seal shoulder without Jam. Cases have been fired 12 times.
Bumped .001 each time. Fireforming 6ppc's with a 22 bullet seals better.
recently a 22-250 a friend has was doing that. New cases solved it.
the old cases were about 30 yrs old but had only been fired twice.
 
Annealing

From my experince, cases need their shoulder-neck area annealed after every 5 or 6 firings to give good seals and consistent seating. Cases annealed properly in this manor will last a very long time. There is a compelling reason one sees the annealing stains on new ammo and or cases.
 
Pete, in comparison to a ppc,and with cases made by the same manufacturer. I question that? I treat the Br in the same manner.
I would assume they would be similiar material and be annealed
about the same. practice cases in ppc have been no problem, lasting
near 50 firings. Never soot on the shoulders
 
Larry M said:
Measuring something like this isn't super precise, but mine sizes .231-.233 as best I can tell. The whole case measures 1.510 and a longer case would obviously have more of the neck sized.
Click to expand...

Larry, my JLC modified Redding Body Die sizes the entire length of the case neck which is about .300 on the 1.510 length cases.

If the die sizes the brass correctly for your chamber, I sure wouldn't get a new die. I bet if you check with the Harrells they can modify it for 'ya. They are good people to work with.
 
I don't mind you questioning

Bob Kingsbury said:
Pete, in comparison to a ppc,and with cases made by the same manufacturer. I question that? I treat the Br in the same manner.
I would assume they would be similiar material and be annealed
about the same. practice cases in ppc have been no problem, lasting
near 50 firings. Never soot on the shoulders
Click to expand...

BUT, if you tried annealing as often as I suggested, you might find that you like the results you get. Any brass, no matter who makes it will work harden quite quickly. I use both Lapua and Winchester and find that both brands harden at about the same rate as they age. It's easy to tell when they need it. One finds that some of the cases seem to allow the bullets to slip into the necks easier than others. The easy ones are the hard ones that return to or near their expanded state. The sooting of the shoulders is not the real issue.
 
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