Dave Kiff's AMAZING Rem 700 Action Truing tool!

[M.D.Spencer]

Checked out the website...

You will need the thread cutting tool, the action lug cutting tool, and several bushings, + more... under a thousand when you are done... check out his website...

http://www.pacifictoolandgauge.com/products.htm

Actually, fond it a little hard to figure out. Guess I need pictures. I do like my Manson tooling, but the tap finally chipped.

Mark

 

[skipkh]

Let me add a little more icing to this cake

To the best of my knowledge, no one else uses the tools in quite the same way I just started using them... but this method can true an action lightning quick AND accurate!

Tools needed:


1.Lathe
2.Gen 2 Tool (from PT&G)
3.GTR reamer/mandrel (from PT&G or Gre-Tan) - only necessary of reaming the bolt raceway
4. .010 oversize Rem tap (from PT&G)
5. Fitted bushings for these tools.
6. Lathe dog
7. A small scrap piece of square metal and a couple of action screws.

Now hold onto your hats, gents! This one is going to thro conventional lathe operation out the window...! The action will be stationary and the cutter will be spinning.

1. Fit your front and rear bushings into the raceway - you want a snug fit - not slip. The bushings should be able to be pushed through the raceway with a bit of finger pressure but shouldn't slide out on their own.

2. If you are reaming the raceway oversize, then slide the GTR reamer/mandrel into the bushings you just put into the action. If you are not reaming, then skip to step 7.

3. Place a lathe dog (yeah - those old things) onto the .705 side of the mandrel.

4. With your lathe set up to turn between centers, and the centers running true, put the madrel/receiver setup into the lathe between the centers. You will want the receiver face end at the tailstock and the tang toward the headstock. You will find these tools are all cut with 60 degree standard centers.

5. Screw two action bolts into the action. I have fabricated a simple holder out of aluminum that my 4-way toolpost can hold. Basically it's a 1/2 X 1/2 x 6" or so block of aluminum with holes drilled at each end for the action bolts to slide in. Nothing fancy...

So now the mandrel is between centers, and the action is on the mandrel centered and supported by two bushings. Action screws are in the holes on the holding block, and the holding block is clamped into the toolpost. Basically, the lathe (via the dog) is turning the mandrel/reamer) and the toolpost is holding the action by it's screws.

6. Set your powerfeed on the lathe to a slow feed and set the lathe to run in REVERSE (clockwise) at around 150 RPM. Start the coolant (or the drip bottle for those of us that can't afford a dedicated cooling pump) and engage the saddle feed. The saddle feed will pull the action across the reamer via the actions screws. Since this is between centers, you can stop when needed to pull out the front bushing and allow the action to center on the newly cut .705 raceway.

7. Take the assembly out of the lathe, replace the bushings with .705 (unless you are not reaming the raceway), put machinist blue on the lug abutments and receiver face, and slip in the Gen-2 tool.
8. Put the dog on the Gen2 and put this assembly back between centers. Use the same actions screws/clamp as used in the reaming operation. Fire up the lathe (again, in REVERSE) and using the carriage wheel, slowly feed the action into the Gen2. This will clean up the threads, and face the receiver/lug abutments in one pass. Run it in just until the blue is wiped form the face and the lug abutments.

9. One more swap - this time take out the Gen2 and put in the .010 oversize tap. Back between centers we go, and tap the thread as usual. Since this tap is also aligned by the bushings, the tap will stay true to the centerline of the action.

It's a pretty simple process, once you've tried it. You don't need to indicate anything in as the centers will ensure there is no runout on either end. There is no load being placed perpendicular to the mandrel - all of this is thrust load agaist the centers, so there should be no risk of deflection. You can take the action out of the lathe whenever you wish and be sure it will go back in alighned (since we're between centers). The work is fast, accurate, and highly repeatable. After the first time, you should be able to do an action (bore raceway, face receiver and lug abutments, clean old threads and then cut new ones) all inside of 15 minutes and without using a single dial guage!

I'm doing a video of it now, and will post it for anyone that needs a visual. I will be demonstrating - at the end - the action put back into a truing jig (the conventional way), and indicated in so that you can see what the runout is on the face, lug abutments and threads... You will see the accuracy is just fantastic with this method

Regards!

 

[jlmomaha]

im thinking about buying one can some one give me a little advice

Ok, so this tool has my attention but I still have some reservations please help me out here. If I understand this right, you put 2 sleeves into your rem action and a handle on this tool a little cutting oil and a few turns later you have cut the face and lugs true to the bore of the receiver?
how accurate is this tool? I am thinking about buying a lathe and doing some work on receivers but if this tool can get close to lathe precision then maybe I'll get one of these to hold me over, I am currently taking advanced lathe in school, and love it, well if any of you guys have used this tool then chucked up the receiver and checked concentricity of the end results?

Again any help is greatly appreciated
Jerry M.

 

[Niccolo M.]

Close but no Cigar!

First, if you go about using this tool in a haphazard method like your post suggests you will not make any improvement over the factory machine work! I further submit that you will ruin your action! Second, if you go back and read my posts you will see that this tool when PROPERLY used is very accurate. If you are not well accustomed to using a lathe and have all of the tooling and indicators you will never ever do as well as this tooling. Third, when you hear folks talking about 20 years experience running a lathe what they are REALLY telling you is they have one year of experience 20 times. Lastly, if you do not have a lathe and the requisite skills and tooling to PROPERLY machine and fit the bolt and then chamber and fit a true match grade barrel you are wasting time even thinking about purchasing any of this tooling. Send out your work to a reputable gunsmith to have it done correctly and spend your free time and the money that you will save learning how to reload CORRECTLY and developing a PROPER shooting technique.

Nic.

 

[Dennis Sorensen]

Ok, so this tool has my attention but I still have some reservations please help me out here. If I understand this right, you put 2 sleeves into your rem action and a handle on this tool a little cutting oil and a few turns later you have cut the face and lugs true to the bore of the receiver?
how accurate is this tool? I am thinking about buying a lathe and doing some work on receivers but if this tool can get close to lathe precision then maybe I'll get one of these to hold me over, I am currently taking advanced lathe in school, and love it, well if any of you guys have used this tool then chucked up the receiver and checked concentricity of the end results?

Again any help is greatly appreciated
Jerry M.

It is extremely accurate... I used to lathe it all and now use this set up because of the huge amount of time saved...

A while ago different methods of “truing” a Remington 700 action were discussed. I mentioned I had purchased some tooling and would be testing it shortly… I bought the tooling from Dave Kiff at Pacific Tool and Die in Oregon.

Previously I had been truing 700 actions in the lathe with considerable time involved. This tooling allows me to do the job much quicker and at a savings to the customer.

The test I did was to machine threads on a barrel stub in the lathe and then screw an unaltered 700 action on to this stub.

I inserted tight fitting straight bushings in the front and rear of the action in the bolt race way. The front of the action required a bushing of .7015”; the rear was .7025”. I then inserted a ground tool (a long piloted tap) made for those bushings and measured the run out just behind the action as I turned the lathe chuck by hand. It had a wobble of .026” behind the action.

I then unscrewed the action and using the piloted cutter that removed a slight amount of the tops of the threads and re-cut the face of the action and the locking lug recesses. I used the piloted tap and re threaded the action. It removed threads more on one side than the other.

After this facing and threading operation I screwed the action back on the threaded stub in the lathe with the same bushings in the bolt race way. I inserted the piloted tool (same as before) and when rotating the lathe chuck by hand found the wobble was now less than .003” behind the action.
I then set the bolt itself up in the lathe and faced less than .002” of the rear of the bolt lugs. They were quite true. Then I took the bare action and screwed a bolt-facing guide into the action threads. I slipped the carbide bolt-facing tool behind the extractor. It is held there like a shell and I inserted the bolt and the tool into the action and the guide closing the bolt. It is held closed while the bolt facing-tool is pushed against the bolt and slowly turned. This is removed, inspected and redone until the bolt face just cleans up evenly. This assures the bolt face is not crooked to the bore.

Factory 700 barrels can still be used with this method although they require head spacing.

Here are two pictures of the run out, before and after...

Here is one picture of the action with the front bushing still in after re threading and facing.

Here is a different action after very lightly lapping the lugs with 600 grit to confirm the fit. Both lugs have good contact. The only reason the front of the lugs and the nose of the bolt are machined is for a more accurate measurement when fitting the barrel.

This is a picture showing although the front and one lug recess are faced true it still needs more facing as the other lug recess is untouched...