Cooper rifles-too good to be true?

Does a Cooper action need truing?

I asked this question to my gunsmith, and the answer was a flat YES

PS If you Shooters would like to take a dip in competitive shooting while doing at your own pace we have a place for the coopers in the Postal League, the Coopers are in the Factory Modified class because they are single shot,
Our factory class states that the rifle must have a magazine well that way Like rifles shoot together, coopers against coopers, coopers against 40x's and so on
Factory guys can take there Remchester,Sako,Tikka,Savage and compete against similar price range guns that are in the spirit of Factory
and right now Two New Factory shooters will be Able to Shoot the entire season for Free .
Last year a Cooper won the Mod class and
a Savage won the Factory Class, Is there anyone with a Remington Varmint to Challange the Savage?
 
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Test Targets

From everything I have heard or read, Cooper rifles are fine rifles. They are beautiful and function very well as hunting rifles. You don't see many of them on the firing line at matches.

As to test targets, well many of the high end rifle manufacturers and ammunition manufacturers include pictures of test targets as evidence of the quality of their product. If you read the fine print you will see those tests are never done in real world conditions. Rifles are tested indoors, probably with handloaded or premium ammunition. Ammunition is tested in specially built test rifles, not some off the shelf gun.

The fact that Anschutz rifles have won more Olympic medals than all others combined means something for sure but are you not buying one of their competition rifles, what does that really mean?

It has also been pointed out to me that two different rifles, off the same assembly line can shoot very differently.

By chance, I bought a $100 Savage Model 19 NRA, with iron sights that let me shoot under a .464" five shot group at 50 yards the first time I took it to the range. What does that say about the Model 19 NRA? I don't really know.
 
Cooper has lotsa options....

Std options may not be accuracy related, BUT. Calibers, more than you need, includes 6mm BR with a choice of twist 10 or 12 Std, Fluted barrels, fluted bolts,
lots of cosmetic stuff [engraving and walnut grades, bring money]. Ring bases are either Leupy or Talley BUT you can really get a base good set of rings from Ken Farrell for all of the Cooper actions [M21 thru xxx]. Custom pull. These are on their website and I am sure if you call Joe at cooper you may be able to get more options [I doubt actions, but you never know]. I ordered a plain vanilla 204 Ruger just to see how this caliber shoots,
no cosmetic stuff. It is a nice caliber to play around with. If it does OK then I get
a 6mmBR, not for comp though. I have NF BR scopes to put both rifles thru a little test on bench rest. Not all dealers special order [FirstStop Guns does].
I suppose Cabela's or such buy existing stock at Cooper. Usually takes 4 mos to 6 mos to get one if you order, depends on options.
 
I think the term we're looking for is factory custom or semi-custom rifles, take your pick.
I have a Cooper mod21 in 22PPC with a Wilson barrel from back in 1999 or 2000. Shot a local factory class score league with it and after placing first that season, Cooper's were kicked out of factory class and into custom where I got my ass handed to me.
It prompted me to build one of the first 30BR's maybe the first in the NY area. The rest was history. Custom is custom. There is no comparison between the two.

Cooper builds a great little (factory built) semi-custom rifle but they can't compare to legitimate BR rifles.

My other Cooper is a mod 21 Phoenix in 17Mach4 which is an amazing varmint rifle. I bought it because I never wanted to bring the 22PPC into the field and take the chance of putting a ding in the stock.
 
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Excellent points Ken.
And my basis for exclusion of cooper as a custom I guess is that I'm not seeing a 'custom' as merely having appearance options -in benchrest.
As you suggest, a benchrest 'custom' is a completely different animal. Whole nother level of purpose built performance.

But IMO, it's in the best interest of many that Cooper be rewarded for the bar they set,, rather than excluded because of it.
 
Custom, or Not

It would seem that the only time this issue would be a "issue" is in some sort of Competition. Shooters might think that a Cooper, or something similiar, would have an advantage because more attention to detail is placed upon them during the manufacturing proccess.

This attention to detail results in a Rifle that is capable of a higher degree of accuracy than one that was just assembled on a typical production line from massproduced parts.

What I call a "Custom" is taking a regular mass produced item, such as a Remington, and performing what ever it takes to correct all of the things that are detremental to performance. Performance, as we define it, means being able to shoot at a level of accuracy that is acceptable in what ever venue we are going to be shooting.

If that venue happens to be a Match, the Rifle might have to possess the ability to shoot, on a consistant basis, 5 shot groups below .350. That is no small order.

In order to do this, the action will have to be trued, the bedding be perfect in a stock that is suitable for accuracy work when shooting off of a bench, a true custom barrel with the proper twist installed, a trigger that will go down past one pound in pull, a quality scope, and last, but not least, a chambering chosen that will have the inherant capability to shoot at that level.

Does a Cooper, aside from being a single shot, (some models), have all of this?? I am not sure. Do their barrels poccess the same potential as a Krieger, Shilen, Hart etc. Are their actions as true as a Panda, or a trued up Remington. Is the trigger capable.

The final test is on the paper. I feel safe in saying that a Cooper, right out of the box, would not stand a chance against any of the multitudes of modified Factory Rifles that I described in the previous paragraphs. But, do keep in mind, that modified Factory Rifle will end up costing more than the Cooper did in the first place.

Ever been to a Car Show?? I used to be involved in that. Good Lord, they have a class for just about every concievable contengency. You go to a show that has 50 cars, and 25 classes. "well, you could be in that class, but those custom fender flares bump you up a class". Heck, I put them on there for tire clearance. Oh Well.

At our Club Matches, I tried to keep it simple. A Factory Rifle must have a magazine, and you can not do anything to it aside from bedding it, and adjusting the trigger.

Buddy Pullig showed up with a decades old Winchester Varminter in 308, and won our last Factory Class going away. Now, you can't buy one of those now. He just happens to have one. Should that Rifle be banned. Of course not. It is a out of the box Factory Rifle that happens to shoot pretty darned good. The fact that he knows how to match the correct load to it, and shoot it, means a lot too.

I think a Savage Model 12 Varminter in 308 will shoot as good. If you are serious about shooting in Factory, and winning, go buy one of those.

In short, a Cooper is not a Custom in the sense that Benchrest Shooters define a Custom. But, in the way that most of the Shooting Public defines Custom, it is. That being, they are not available at just any Gun Store, and they cost a lot. And, they do possess that intangible that has nothing to do with Rifle performance, but means a lot to many owners. That is "desireability"............jackie
 
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Jackie...in response to your comments on the Cooper rifle and it's capabilities...I too was not convinced that a Cooper would shoot along with custom rifles...but at our last VFS Match (unregistered) we had a new shooter with a (factory) Cooper .223 A.I. topped with a Leupold 6.5x20 LR scope shooting with "no windflags" and a Midway front rest..He shot a 249-10x at 100 yards :eek:..and the only factory action rifle to beat him was a Savage target action which had been customized with Shilen match 6mm BR barrel and a BR stock...his score was 249-13x....
I have a very healthy respect for the Cooper Varmint rifles now...
 
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