Cold blue for a barrel

B

Brian

Guest
Has anyone here ever been happy with a barrel cold bluing job they've done themselves? I'm putting together a .223 bolt action rifle for my disabled brother. It's just for target and plinking and I need to keep costs down. I have a shilen blank on order from Midway. I have a lathe so I was hoping that would be a big help prepping the barrel. Would anyone here have any advice on the procedure and/or a particular product to use?
 
The only way that's barely half a chance is to apply the cold blue with sections of those green plastic cleaning pads. Rub generous amounts like hell & wash off. Discard that piece of pad & use another, etc.
 
Cold Blue

From what limited experience I have it seems like the content of the steel and its finish have a LOT to do with your success. Occasionally I buy a few barrels as a lot and then resell them, mostly Savage's, and one of the things I do is to clean them up as good as I can and then use cold blue as a touch-up. I've had barrels that took the blue and came out looking almost like new, others the "blue" is almost purple and does not match the finish at all. For what I do it's acceptable but barely so. Once I get a few projects completed I'm going to put together a cerakote/duracoat/etc etc oven and do things right!
 
In lieu of any cold blue, I would opt for a Duracote finish. They make a kit with the degreaser, paint and propellant canister, and it is not difficult to do. Should keep cost down.
 
Brian said:
Has anyone here ever been happy with a barrel cold bluing job they've done themselves? I'm putting together a .223 bolt action rifle for my disabled brother. It's just for target and plinking and I need to keep costs down. I have a shilen blank on order from Midway. I have a lathe so I was hoping that would be a big help prepping the barrel. Would anyone here have any advice on the procedure and/or a particular product to use?
Click to expand...

If you decide to go for bluing:
The RUST BLUE as used by the English gunsmiths from the 1900's to date is about the best I have seen & used, I did an English shotgun back in the late 80's and it turned out very nice.,The only drawback is that the metal needs to be
buffed/ polished after each coat of the bluing solution and it takes a good 9+ or more cots for a nice color...I believe that I gave my shotgun like 9-12 coats

Next to this poruduct (Rust blue) goes the Oxpho Blue (Brownell's sells it)

The secret is to perfectly degrease the part you want to blue and always keep in mind that the finish that you do on the barrel before bluing is the finish that you will get when done.

Regards,

azuaro
 
OK, just to counter Ezell I'll answer


yes



:)



WITH this qualifier...... I went to gunsmithing school. I blued several old rifles and a double using "Zischang" and "Neidner" formulas using an acid mix saturated with iron.


It was a lot of work, took weeks and the final results were nothing short of incredible. But it DOES NOT look like hot-dip bluing and it DOES NOT come from a bottle. That said, I have on my shelf, Oxpho-Blue, 44-40 Formula and Dicropan T-4. All sold as "professional cold blues" for touchup or entire rifles.


They suck.

I'd never recommend them for an entire rifle.

I have done several muzzle-loader barrels using "Plum Brown" from a bottle and they came out OK.

opinionby





al
 
alinwa said:
OK, just to counter Ezell I'll answer


yes



:)



WITH this qualifier...... I went to gunsmithing school. I blued several old rifles and a double using "Zischang" and "Neidner" formulas using an acid mix saturated with iron.


It was a lot of work, took weeks and the final results were nothing short of incredible. But it DOES NOT look like hot-dip bluing and it DOES NOT come from a bottle. That said, I have on my shelf, Oxpho-Blue, 44-40 Formula and Dicropan T-4. All sold as "professional cold blues" for touchup or entire rifles.


They suck.

I'd never recommend them for an entire rifle.

I have done several muzzle-loader barrels using "Plum Brown" from a bottle and they came out OK.

opinionby





al
Click to expand...
We can always count on you, Al:)

I ASSUMED he was referring to the quickie cold blues in bottles, sold as wonder products.

I prefer the rust blue solutions if I'm stuck with something in a bottle....but I'm not.

Mike
 
cold blue

I use cold blue to make a black finish that's pretty durable. Take a freshly bead blasted part and rinse in hot water to warm it up ,with a brush or cotton pad flood the part with cold blue and keep it wet with the blueing for a minute or so rinse with hot water again. then lay the part on a towel and hose it with wd-40 I mean soak the part and towel roll it up and let it cure for 24 hours. make sure it stays wet with wd-40. after it cures wipe it off and oil it. Makes a black finish that looks like parkerizing and it's pretty durable. I like the ospho blue best but they all seem to work.
 
COLD BLUE SUCKS IN ALL FORMS!! I've used it all..........hot blue is the only alternative? It sucks too!! I dread the day i have to fire that P.O.S up. I don't have the room in my shop to leave it set up year round though. Nasty stuff none-the-less!!?

MED
 
alinwa said:
OK, just to counter Ezell I'll answer


yes
I have on my shelf, Oxpho-Blue, 44-40 Formula and Dicropan T-4. All sold as "professional cold blues" for touchup or entire rifles. They suck.

You said it much better than I was able to...Yes, those formulas are good for re-touching minor scratches, for bluing screws or very small parts but NOT GOOD for an entire rifle.

The English Slow Rust Bluing formulas are OK for an entire gun but as you imply, they will never give you the deep color and are pretty slow, messy and tedious work...Other than for restoring antique
guns that originally came with that finish, I wouldn't consider this process. I have only done a pair of old English shotguns and I had enough with that.

Have a good week,

azuaro
Click to expand...
 
Herters Belgian Blue

If you have a tank big enough to boil the parts in the Herters Belgian Blue is far better than the cold blues and it only takes an hour or so to do once the polishing is done. It is done in much the same manner as a traditional rust blue but you don't have to wait for it to rust between coats as it colors instantly. It usually takes about five or six cycles to get a nice finish. It doesn't have the luster of a traditional cold rust blue but it gives a dark even durable finish.

Dennis
 
Brownells Oxpho-Blue liquid can give a damn good finish if you remember that cold bluing is an autocatalyic plating process. It requires chemically clean steel. This means a fresh polish and a wetting agent helps a great deal. If you can manage it, wipe down the freshly polished and degreased barrel with a paper towel dampened with a 50-50 mixture of water and muriatic acid ( hardware store). Immediatly follow with a soaking wet paper towel pad dipped in Oxpho-Blue. The steel surface will turn black in a few seconds. Continue until the entire surface is covered. Wash off in hot water and rub down with WD-40. You are done. There is no cure time(that is a myth).

If you can't handle the acid solution. A fresh polish with abrasive paper or a bead blast will do nearly as well if you use a wetting agent. I use 409 household cleaner. Immediately after polishing or blasting cover the metal with 409 and then hit it with a 4/0 steel wool pad soaked with Oxpho Blue. Make long strokes up and down the barrel and apply the solution generously. Do this over a sink and after a few strokes flush the surface with cold water. Reapply 409 and hit it with Oxpho Blue again until everthing is black. It shouldn't take more than 2 or 3 min. Wash off and apply WD-40.

The acid and steel wool removes the invisible iron oxide film that forms freshly polished steel. It is so thin that it is invisible, but it is there. The film inhibits the blue solution from contacting bare iron and causes the spotting, streaking, and other problems most people have. The 409 removes any residual finger print oil and reduces the surface tension of the liquids involved. The blue contains copper nitrate which plates out a thin copper film on the iron surface. The copper is immediately turned black by the selenous acid also contained in the blue. So, a nice uniform black color requires an uniform coating of copper and that is only possible with an oxide free iron surface. Once you get the hang of it, the finish can look very much like a hot blue job except for one thing; you can smell the copper if you put your nose to it.

RWO
 
RWO said:
Brownells Oxpho-Blue liquid can give a damn good finish if you remember that cold bluing is an autocatalyic plating process. It requires chemically clean steel. This means a fresh polish and a wetting agent helps a great deal. If you can manage it, wipe down the freshly polished and degreased barrel with a paper towel dampened with a 50-50 mixture of water and muriatic acid ( hardware store). Immediatly follow with a soaking wet paper towel pad dipped in Oxpho-Blue. The steel surface will turn black in a few seconds. Continue until the entire surface is covered. Wash off in hot water and rub down with WD-40. You are done. There is no cure time(that is a myth).

If you can't handle the acid solution. A fresh polish with abrasive paper or a bead blast will do nearly as well if you use a wetting agent. I use 409 household cleaner. Immediately after polishing or blasting cover the metal with 409 and then hit it with a 4/0 steel wool pad soaked with Oxpho Blue. Make long strokes up and down the barrel and apply the solution generously. Do this over a sink and after a few strokes flush the surface with cold water. Reapply 409 and hit it with Oxpho Blue again until everthing is black. It shouldn't take more than 2 or 3 min. Wash off and apply WD-40.

The acid and steel wool removes the invisible iron oxide film that forms freshly polished steel. It is so thin that it is invisible, but it is there. The film inhibits the blue solution from contacting bare iron and causes the spotting, streaking, and other problems most people have. The 409 removes any residual finger print oil and reduces the surface tension of the liquids involved. The blue contains copper nitrate which plates out a thin copper film on the iron surface. The copper is immediately turned black by the selenous acid also contained in the blue. So, a nice uniform black color requires an uniform coating of copper and that is only possible with an oxide free iron surface. Once you get the hang of it, the finish can look very much like a hot blue job except for one thing; you can smell the copper if you put your nose to it.

RWO
Click to expand...

Great post!

I will try this all out..... maybe restore my faith in Oxpho-Blue ;)

al
 
I don't think Oxpho Blue has selenious acid or copper in it. It seems much more durable than 44-40, which does stink, from selenium. Depends on the steel composition for the final look. I had trouble bluing a part on a Springfield, until I washed it with a phosphoric acid auto prep solution, then hit it with Oxpho blue. Went really black. Also heating and spraying with WD40 after bluing seems to help the durability--WD40 should smoke slightly when applied, must be about 300 deg F.
 
xs hedspace said:
I don't think Oxpho Blue has selenious acid or copper in it. It seems much more durable than 44-40, which does stink, from selenium. Depends on the steel composition for the final look. I had trouble bluing a part on a Springfield, until I washed it with a phosphoric acid auto prep solution, then hit it with Oxpho blue. Went really black. Also heating and spraying with WD40 after bluing seems to help the durability--WD40 should smoke slightly when applied, must be about 300 deg F.
Click to expand...

From the lable of Oxpho-blue....
Contains phosphoric and selenious acid and nickle sulfate...
 
As usual, I was half right...no copper. But it's still more durable than 44-40, unless they changed the 44-40 formula--haven't used that stuff for 15 years. One technique for oxpho blue is to dip 4/0 steel wool, degreased, in the stuff, and rub hard. Good for touchups that way. I always wondered if SS could be blued, by doing a copper sulphate/weak sulfuric acid copper flash coat, then blackening the copper with cold blue. Igor, to the lab!
 
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Oops. Under effects of overexposure, it lists dizzyness and lassitude. Aha! I always thought those came from my Yukon Jack in my afternoon coffee.:cool:
 
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