Oh, by the way. My 1st barrel Kreiger 14 twist. Shot a club record after 3000 rounds.............What ya got?.....Practice fell off after that....WORK got in the way. Then junk Stainless barrels......
Are Machinists Skills Necessary?
- Thread starter Chism G
- Start date
Oh, by the way. My 1st barrel Kreiger 14 twist. Shot a club record after 3000 rounds.............What ya got?.....Practice fell off after that....WORK got in the way. Then junk Stainless barrels......
David you may be correct. My attitude has a lot to do with it. It's a long story........I don't like to practice. Even load testing on Friday has it's limits......
Thanks
My question brought out some reputable craftsmen of the Sport. Thanks,Gentlemen for taking the time to share your thoughts. I have always thought I was leaving something on the table by not owning a lathe and learning how to use it. In my opinion,convenience is a competitive advantage.
I,ve learned in this Sport that its you against the Range and conditions. Same as in Golf. Some Ranges can be a challenge,simply by design.
Owning a private range would certainly be a competitive advantage. I’ll find out when I win the Lotto.
The general consensus in response to my question,appears to be,
“Deep Pockets,(money Rules,can't argue that one ) plus Machiniists Skills and a Private range or access to a suitable facility in close proximity to residence. will greatly enhance your shooting skills ” A definite advantage.
You can still have a lot of fun without the aforementioned assets, as I do. But,it doesn't hurt to dream. Just my thoughts.
Glenn
My question brought out some reputable craftsmen of the Sport. Thanks,Gentlemen for taking the time to share your thoughts. I have always thought I was leaving something on the table by not owning a lathe and learning how to use it. In my opinion,convenience is a competitive advantage.
I,ve learned in this Sport that its you against the Range and conditions. Same as in Golf. Some Ranges can be a challenge,simply by design.
Owning a private range would certainly be a competitive advantage. I’ll find out when I win the Lotto.
The general consensus in response to my question,appears to be,
“Deep Pockets,(money Rules,can't argue that one ) plus Machiniists Skills and a Private range or access to a suitable facility in close proximity to residence. will greatly enhance your shooting skills ” A definite advantage.
You can still have a lot of fun without the aforementioned assets, as I do. But,it doesn't hurt to dream. Just my thoughts.
Glenn
Wow Jerry. It sounds like ya won the lottery.
And ya got friends.
I have been told I am lucky. Being 1 hour from 2 ranges. One has concrete benches, the other rickety wood.....
I got a call tonight. The rickety wood benches, maybe gone soon. That club has finally gotten around to doing something about concrete benches....
Glenn those thoughts have run through my head a lot. Long story here....
So I met a bullet maker and he had the first custom rifle I ever saw. Wow. Did it shot. He always had a perfect score. At the time I did not know about the NBRSA or IBS. Just a local club. Everyone was real nice.
Next thing ya know a famous Shooter passed away. And the bullet maker had a rifle to sell. And it was a beauty.
Then he shows me how to make bullets. That was 8-9 yrs ago. Today I wore out another work bench. I was wondering what that noise was.....
Anyway. I am done making bullets. I might have enough to get me through to the end.....The lathe, don't have room for a lathe.
Still going to local matches. The score league starts next Tues. Hope the bullet maker can make it.
I have to agree with Ron. Seeing someone else shoot with a barrel you chambered and winning is really gratifying, it also makes ya made when they beat ya.
Someone else also mentioned the personality thing. Yep, most all the big names are very driven, not taking the easy road. It is that way in any sport. The old adage" The harder I try the better I do".
Joe Hynes
Oh and yes I have a lathe and my own range. Just came in from shooting.
Someone else also mentioned the personality thing. Yep, most all the big names are very driven, not taking the easy road. It is that way in any sport. The old adage" The harder I try the better I do".
Joe Hynes
Oh and yes I have a lathe and my own range. Just came in from shooting.
goodgrouper
tryingtobeabettergrouper
Holy smokes! I knew these guys were getting serious quantities ordered, but I couldn't even fathom ordering 30 barrels. Just chambering that many would be a full time job for quite some time!
When I had a chat with Tony Boyer a couple years ago, he said that he was "trying lots of barrels", but he wouldn't put a number on it.
goodgrouper
tryingtobeabettergrouper
Yep, I agree. I used to get barrels that I felt were competitive up to 2000 rounds. Even won some wood with one that was fried inside out according to the borescope. But I haven't had one like that post '09. The last few I've had seem to go right down the swirler bowl at about 500.
Sure makes you want to go practice when you know you might go through 1/5 the barrel's accuracy life that day!
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goodgrouper
tryingtobeabettergrouper
jackie schmidt
New member
I haven't bought a new barrel blank in 5 years. The barrels I have been chambering as of late are ones I have had for a while. I had no idea that the barrel situation was so deplorable.
The barrel I was going to shoot The a Bluebonnet with is one from about 2005 that I cut the whole chamber off of, and re chambered it. It shoots pretty darned good. I will take it to Seymour in two weeks.
What's the deal with the barrels? I doubt the 416R material most makers used has changed, but then, since Crucible had it's problems, I might be wrong.
It did always tickle me when I would read where a certain Champion used a certain barrel, when you knew, for a fact, that he had to go through a whole pile to find one good enough.
The barrel I was going to shoot The a Bluebonnet with is one from about 2005 that I cut the whole chamber off of, and re chambered it. It shoots pretty darned good. I will take it to Seymour in two weeks.
What's the deal with the barrels? I doubt the 416R material most makers used has changed, but then, since Crucible had it's problems, I might be wrong.
It did always tickle me when I would read where a certain Champion used a certain barrel, when you knew, for a fact, that he had to go through a whole pile to find one good enough.
JerrySharrett
Senile Member
Barrel steel is a problem. Where did that come from? I have chambered and shot Bartlein and Krieger barrels that I bought in 2013 and shot in the 2014 season. They gave all done as well as barrels I did in 1999 and 2000. I did have one barrel, around 2006, that had an overlapped place about 6" from the muzzle which caused it to copper after just 5-6 shots. That barrel was replaced by the manufacturer.
What troubles me personally about the IS steel industry is we nave none now apparently. Its all made in Communist China from coal that is shipped from just about 80 miles North of me, The CSX coal trains, carrying 120 100 ton cars of coal go by here every few minutes, several an hour. Where do they go? To a seaport in South Carolina where the coal is loaded on ships to Communist China and now probably to Communist Vietnam.
Getting into the NO-NO of this board for a moment, all the scrap steel from the WTC fiasco was IMMEDIATELY shipped to China BEFORE any forensic testing was done. Can you imagine, in just a few days ALL the WTC steel was shipped out and the remaining debris was dumped in the ocean.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxycV4fNPnQ
.
What troubles me personally about the IS steel industry is we nave none now apparently. Its all made in Communist China from coal that is shipped from just about 80 miles North of me, The CSX coal trains, carrying 120 100 ton cars of coal go by here every few minutes, several an hour. Where do they go? To a seaport in South Carolina where the coal is loaded on ships to Communist China and now probably to Communist Vietnam.
Getting into the NO-NO of this board for a moment, all the scrap steel from the WTC fiasco was IMMEDIATELY shipped to China BEFORE any forensic testing was done. Can you imagine, in just a few days ALL the WTC steel was shipped out and the remaining debris was dumped in the ocean.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxycV4fNPnQ
.
are machinests skills necessary?
Guys the steel. Thank the US government for the steel '' They shut down steel production and a lot of other industries by stopping steel production.
The bar stock at crucible is still some great steel but its re cycled steel and always was. scrap was melted and additives were added to come up with a formula.
The biggest problem is the bar stock and how its handled. The heat treat from the producer has a lot to do with it.
If the bars aren't handled properly they take a set and are sent to the Bar straightening . That's where the problem is.
The bars look straight but have been corrected by bending them to shape. That puts stress into the bars that can't be removed , even with heat treating.
The producers know this and it, but everything goes out the door. It would be way to expensive for them to scrap the bars.
There are some simple solutions to that problem but few people have addressed the issue. Its easier to just let it go or complain.
Guys the steel. Thank the US government for the steel '' They shut down steel production and a lot of other industries by stopping steel production.
The bar stock at crucible is still some great steel but its re cycled steel and always was. scrap was melted and additives were added to come up with a formula.
The biggest problem is the bar stock and how its handled. The heat treat from the producer has a lot to do with it.
If the bars aren't handled properly they take a set and are sent to the Bar straightening . That's where the problem is.
The bars look straight but have been corrected by bending them to shape. That puts stress into the bars that can't be removed , even with heat treating.
The producers know this and it, but everything goes out the door. It would be way to expensive for them to scrap the bars.
There are some simple solutions to that problem but few people have addressed the issue. Its easier to just let it go or complain.
JerrySharrett
Senile Member
OK, GM, what is the simple solution and is it less fun than bitching and griping?
My solution would be to scrap the whole bunch of alphabet agencies, EPA, OSHA, IRS, CIA, NSA, FED. and the rest!!
But come 2016, every one will vote the same old ticket and expect different results. So it will be Jeb Clinton or Hillary Bush or some cross-dresser from Guatemala!!
AndyTaber
New member
Too easy to blame the U.S. Government for everything. Steel production and usage peaked in the mid 70's and fell from there. The decline of the railroads, construction of large skyscrapers dried up, ships were being built more with aluminum than steel, bridge building relied more on pre-cast concrete than steel. The steel industry prioritized on short term profits rather than long term innovation. This is what killed U.S. steel production.
Pete Wass
Well-known member
You are correct
We are too far down the road and the troth has gotten way too big to see any changes until finally the money runs out. There is nothing we can do about it anyway.
Pete
We are too far down the road and the troth has gotten way too big to see any changes until finally the money runs out. There is nothing we can do about it anyway.
Pete
Joe Maisto
New member
.True enough Charlie. If there is anyone doesn't believe that , pay attention to Mr. LC.
are machinests skills necessary?
easy solution to straight bars is the cradle holding the bar stock that is put into the furnace at heat treat and bar anneal.
being careful to get the bars stock straight in the furnace when taken to temps and drawn, open the furnace and shut it down , let cool
The bar stock that is that twist's is culled out and sent back to melt. The steel that,s cold enough to be handled is then hand set on to a pallet for final cooling{ the pallet is long enough to support the bars .
care is give to ensure that the bar stock is supported all the way thru. The bars are then cut up into barrel lengths as requested by the customer. at the short stage the bar stock is then sent to bar anneal to soften them as to specs { final draw. a mini mill could handle this with few problems.
The big deal is large companies want to sell volume. I know one barrel maker that had to buy a whole heat {furnace] and then still had problems .
easy solution to straight bars is the cradle holding the bar stock that is put into the furnace at heat treat and bar anneal.
being careful to get the bars stock straight in the furnace when taken to temps and drawn, open the furnace and shut it down , let cool
The bar stock that is that twist's is culled out and sent back to melt. The steel that,s cold enough to be handled is then hand set on to a pallet for final cooling{ the pallet is long enough to support the bars .
care is give to ensure that the bar stock is supported all the way thru. The bars are then cut up into barrel lengths as requested by the customer. at the short stage the bar stock is then sent to bar anneal to soften them as to specs { final draw. a mini mill could handle this with few problems.
The big deal is large companies want to sell volume. I know one barrel maker that had to buy a whole heat {furnace] and then still had problems .
Are machinist skill necessary
Tim that,s the typical corporate answer and you know it.
Demand slowed down do to all of the great society and its BS .
OSHA and the EPA had a lot to do with it along with government policy set by the temporary occupants of the white house.
A a political agenda to shut down industry in the US under the guise of keeping america healthy. Truth is the demand was always there there.
Jerry I agree with your stand on the government agencies most of them stink .
Just who is the next pres / I don't know but one thing I do know the older ones are RINOS
Tim that,s the typical corporate answer and you know it.
Demand slowed down do to all of the great society and its BS .
OSHA and the EPA had a lot to do with it along with government policy set by the temporary occupants of the white house.
A a political agenda to shut down industry in the US under the guise of keeping america healthy. Truth is the demand was always there there.
Jerry I agree with your stand on the government agencies most of them stink .
Just who is the next pres / I don't know but one thing I do know the older ones are RINOS
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