I've been hooked... but I'm on a budget

D

DougMH

Guest
:confused:I'm new to benchrest.com and I recently joined Fairfax Rod & Gun Club (FFR&G), Manassas, VA. I participated in a 200 yd Benchrest match there last weekend. I used my semi-custom F/TR rifle because I didn't have anything else. I'm sure most of you guys are rich beyond belief, and have $$$ millions $$$ in your rifles, but here's what I'm thinking on my budget (work to be done by my F/TR builder at Sharp Shooter's Supply).

So, after you all look at it, I will take all criticism... especially if there lurk rules violations. I will likely never use it beyond 200 yds. FFR&G has one 300 yd lane, but they cannot conduct matches there.

Action: Savage 12 Target Action (client supplied)
Barrel:
Brux
24"
LARGE SHANK TARGET = 1.120" breech > 1" muzzle
.308 caliber chambered to 30 BR
1:16 Twist

Stock:
Thumbhole Bench Rest Stock

Trigger: Evolution

Of course, Fred builds it with all the right stuff

... then I'm going to need help on reloading... but that's for another topic.


Doug Hurst
Maj USMC(Ret)
Springfield, VA
 
there are weight limits to consider..unless this is "club" level only...but i think they hold sanctioned matches...
mike in co

DougMH said:
:confused:I'm new to benchrest.com and I recently joined Fairfax Rod & Gun Club (FFR&G), Manassas, VA. I participated in a 200 yd Benchrest match there last weekend. I used my semi-custom F/TR rifle because I didn't have anything else. I'm sure most of you guys are rich beyond belief, and have $$$ millions $$$ in your rifles, but here's what I'm thinking on my budget (work to be done by my F/TR builder at Sharp Shooter's Supply).

So, after you all look at it, I will take all criticism... especially if there lurk rules violations. I will likely never use it beyond 200 yds. FFR&G has one 300 yd lane, but they cannot conduct matches there.

Action: Savage 12 Target Action (client supplied)
Barrel:
Brux
24"
LARGE SHANK TARGET = 1.120" breech > 1" muzzle
.308 caliber chambered to 30 BR
1:16 Twist

Stock:
Thumbhole Bench Rest Stock

Trigger: Evolution

Of course, Fred builds it with all the right stuff

... then I'm going to need help on reloading... but that's for another topic.


Doug Hurst
Maj USMC(Ret)
Springfield, VA
Click to expand...
 
Also, you can buy a good used BR rifle for $1500-$1600 if ya keep an eye out. There may be someone at FF that's got something to sell. You could see, fondle, and probably shoot it before you buy it. And then of course comes the help from the seller, most are very willing, and can be worth the cost of the gun.
 
I would recommend the used BR rifle as well and check out "The List" at shooters corner owned/operated by Bob White. I went down the same road that you did with a savage lrpv and after trying hard to make it shoot like a custom I finally went the custom route. Each shot that popped out of the group I would wonder if it was something in the action or was it me. It is not that the savages don't shoot well as I am a big fan of their accuracy potential, but the consistency needed in this game is too high to leave anything to chance.
You will also come close to spending as much on the action, the evolution trigger and the timing/truing of the action with Fred as you would with a full custom and a jewel/shilen trigger. A used BR rig will get your foot in the door and you will most likely be able to sell it for close to what you paid for it. Put a nice Weaver or Sightron 36x if you aren't inclined to go for a nightforce or leupold - (all of which will win matches) and you are ready to go.
I call my savage "Count de Money" for what I spent before I bought the right stuff, and wish I had followed my own advice.
Good luck in your search and welcome to the downward spiral...or is it black hole.
As to the millionaire comment - I have approximately $6.5million in my score rig and that is without the scope. I sold my first of four luxury hotels to fund the action and stock and am waiting on the tower in Dubai to be finished before I can get a barrel, bullets, and dies...primers, a scope, and powder are next year.
Mike
 
If you are really hooked and really serious then the first thing to do is forget the Savage. Don't get me wrong, I have several including a Target Action that has one of Fred's Evolution triggers. Although it's tempting, I won't comment on Fred or his work.

You will spend more money on a Savage than a decent used benchrest rifle will cost you and you will never be competitive. So if you really are on a budget, you simply can't afford to try and compete with a Savage. It is quite possible to find a trued Remington 40X, 700 or XP100 in an older benchrest stock that will be competitive from day one. It will probably come with a Jewell trigger or at the very least a reworked Remington. You can easily find these rifles for under $1000, sometimes well under. Have a new barrel chambered up and you will be ready to compete. It won't be a new BAT, but it can be a winner. At the very least you will learn to shoot with it and you can probably recover most or maybe even all your $$ should you decide to move on.

Forget the Savage and forget Fred.

Rick
 
I know what you want to do, budget and all, and I'm begging you not to do it. The rifle you're suggesting may very well be a barn burner but the odds are against it. Keep on shooting what you shot "last weekend" and watch what's goin' on - all the while putting a few bucks back to make up the difference in what you are saying you want and what you really want. I sold some of my teeth to get my first real live benchrest rifle only to find out I coulda waited.
 
Lots of used rifles on custom actions out there for less than you will put into a Savage trying to make it competitive. If you tire of it, you can sell it and get your money out of it as long as it is a "normal" configuration.

Depending on what game you are playing, a 30 may, or may not be the best choice.
 
Major, Listen to these men, they know of what they speak. I have also sent you a Private Message so check your box.

Roland
 
Wilbur said:
I know what you want to do, budget and all, and I'm begging you not to do it. The rifle you're suggesting may very well be a barn burner but the odds are against it. Keep on shooting what you shot "last weekend" and watch what's goin' on - all the while putting a few bucks back to make up the difference in what you are saying you want and what you really want. I sold some of my teeth to get my first real live benchrest rifle only to find out I coulda waited.
Click to expand...

I must agree with Wilbur, not that thats bad. I started with a Rem 40XBR that was built by Kelbly with a new Krieger barrel in 6PPC, Kelbly trigger, Kelbly stock and a 36X Sightron scope. I made my first set of brass (because I already had a lot of experience doing so), and bought a couple thousand bullets and went to the chippewa for my first BR match.
I was very soon convinced that I must have a full custom rig to be able to compete, so I scratched and dug to get one (full custom BR rifle).
Long story very short...get something like I started with or maybe a little better and spend your money on brass, bullets, primers, powder and wind flags (and learn how to use those wind flags). Wear out a barrel or two while shooting local matches and practicing.......then decide where you want to go from there.
Please stay away from the Savage action for short range BR and save youself some money and heart ache from the start!
If you want to PM me, feel free.
Mark
 
Just to add to what everyone else is saying, when you look for a used custom, concentrate on 6PPC and make sure it is 10.5 pounds max weight(light varmint or sporter). That way you can shoot it in any class, at any match, and get as much experience in the shortest amount of time.

Jerry
 
I was in the same boat your in about 10,12 years ago. Wanted a bench rifle and was gonna buy a savage. Got on here and the guys told me the same thing they are tellin you. Get a used benchrest rifle, thats what I did, never had a second thought about it since. Got a Kelbly,Shilen,Jewell from Hoehn. Never been sorry about it. Its a different world from the savages I been around. Doug
 
If your club shoots only Varmint For Score, you might jump right into a 13.5 lb 30 BR. OTOH, you can usually make a 10.5 lb rifle into a 13.5 lb rifle and often not vice versa.
 
While we're here, I've encountered some really, really good shooting 40X rifles. Starting there wouldn't leave a fellow out in the cold until he could see better.
 
I really appreciate all the advice and the time it must have taken to do the write-ups. I'll check with Wayne that runs our matches and see if he can help me find a good used custom.
 
Suggest you re-read what GrayFox said above. He is dead on point. I have been there and done that.

Last year I sold my XP-100 BR rifle with two good barrels for $1,100 dollars. My shooting buddies have picked up Pandas for under $1,000. From time to time there are some very good deals on used BR rifles. They are much cheaper to buy than to build.

I have several Savages. Love them but they do not make the cut for BR competition.

Octopus
 
I'm curious... what, in your opinion(s), makes the 40X (in my view an over-priced 700VS, and yes I've had both of 'em), XP-100, or 700 a viable option for a BR gun, but the Savage Target Action rifles not? I'm not arguing full-custom vs. factory; I understand the peculiarities of how competitive BR is shot put a factory action at a disadvantage in ways beyond just the accuracy. But one worked-over factory action vs. another?
 
Milanuk,

I have owned and have seen several 40X bench rest rifles that would agg 0.150 or better. Likewise I have owned and I have seen several Savage rifles that were quite good. But I have never seen one agg better than 0.25 and few ever do that. For the dollars the Savages are good value. But they do not make the grade for short range BR shooting.

I think the Savage issue may be with the bolt & firing pin. (And the triggers) For BR you need a Jewel or equal trigger. I have never seen a trigger for the Savage that made the grade.

Usually the 40X actions, and XP-100 actions, used for BR are single shot. They are stiffer than the repeaters. That said it still takes a good gunsmith a lot of work to make a 40 X action into a precision action for BR shooting. If you are starting from scratch the custom actions actions cost less in the long run.

Octopus
 
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Jerry W said:
Just to add to what everyone else is saying, when you look for a used custom, concentrate on 6PPC and make sure it is 10.5 pounds max weight(light varmint or sporter). That way you can shoot it in any class, at any match, and get as much experience in the shortest amount of time.

Jerry
Click to expand...

Bad Advice for the matches he is shooting in the location he resides. Granted once in a blue moon a 6 PPC wins a match here. There is little to no Group Shooting in this area (VA-MD)

He is on the right path in the first place as far as a HV 30BR.

I also completely agree with all the people who suggest a used Custom Action BR rifle rather than putting another dollar in a Savage. I have seen quite a few Stolles , Hall's, and Hart's for under $1500 right here in the classifieds.

Octopus said:
My shooting buddies have picked up Pandas for under $1,000. From time to time there are some very good deals on used BR rifles. They are much cheaper to buy than to build.

I have several Savages. Love them but they do not make the cut for BR competition.

Octopus
Click to expand...

Those were really good deals

Dick
 
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Dick Grosbier said:
Bad Advice for the matches he is shooting in the location he resides. Granted once in a blue moon a 6 PPC wins a match here. There is little to no Group Shooting in this area (VA-MD)
Click to expand...

Thanks for clearing that up Dick. I'm not familiar with that area of the country. Since the original post didn't specify score or group, I was just trying to advise on a rifle that would be within the rules at any possible match he could attend. Maximum trigger time to build experience.
 
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