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Thread: How about Shooting Coaches?

  1. #16
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    Nov 2006
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    Augusta, Maine & Palm Coast, Fl
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    I had wanted to ask Al

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Friedrich View Post
    I agree with mentorship Ray, Al was also my mentor. Would bug him 2-3 times a day sometimes and he never complained. Living 3000 miles apart did not help but Al was always there in Spirit.

    Regards,
    Joe
    about what to look for in no wind conditions. I noticed he always seemed to shoot well in them but I waited too long. My idea on coaching was to simply watch the other lad shoot, observing flags and their table manors and discuss it with them after they have finished shooting. I guess it's easy to get the wrong idea about the process but there is nothing wrong with observing and reporting that I am aware of.

    Pete

  2. #17
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    Pete, no worries here whatever it takes to help someone. I did not have anyone, zero help except what could be read on the forums till I got ahold of AL, the rest is history.

    Regards,
    Joe

  3. #18
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    Feb 2006
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    Wilcox, PA
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by joe friedrich View Post
    pete, no worries here whatever it takes to help someone. I did not have anyone, zero help except what could be read on the forums till i got ahold of al, the rest is history.

    Regards,
    joe
    i didnt have any coaching shot nights after milking in 70 s did go t6o camulis terrible at 200 last group no sighter 5 on record one hole.320 got taped on shoulder by fellow name4d miles hollister sad you are the type fellow i like to see just try to rember how ypou did that.

  4. #19
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    Thanks Joe

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Friedrich View Post
    Pete, no worries here whatever it takes to help someone. I did not have anyone, zero help except what could be read on the forums till I got ahold of AL, the rest is history.

    Regards,
    Joe
    WE'LL TALK SOMETIME!

    Pete

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
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    14

    Coaches

    My club is talking about organizing a rimfire BR seminar this winter to aid newer shooters in honing their skills. I am relatively new to the game but benefited from our weekly fun shoots where we could talk and learn from each other. I also have had help from a few mentors who aided me in reading flags and learning what do do for certain conditions as well as methods for cleaning my bbl between matches. All has helped. One of our top UL shooters gave me a set of simple wind flags to supplement the junk I was using. He has been a great help. I am lucky to live where we have several top shooters all at the same club. It forms a core group of knowledge which feeds all the rest. I will say that sometimes we don't agree but my approach is when somebody shows me a technique that works for them, I will try it and if it works, adapt it to my bag of tricks and if not, I set it asside. For example, I shoot fast. I like to keep a rhythm or cadence to my shooting. One shot about every 20-30 sec or a bit less. I usually finish a 25 bull ARA card in 10-11 minutes unless there are tough wind conditions to slow me down. One day a top shooter walked by as I finished a card in 9 min and said, "You are shooting too fast. You will do better if you slow down." I had just scored a perfect 2500 so, I looked up and like a smart a$$ said, "Nope, don't think so.", lol. He is a slow and methodical shooter and frankly does very well like that. It works for him. No wrong answer there. I have made mistakes that might have been avoided if I had gone slower but those are rare.

  6. #21
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    Feb 2006
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    Wilcox, PA
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by pete wass View Post
    i have had the theory for a time that most of us if not all could benefit greatly by having a shooting coach, just as other athletes have coaches. I think for older folks, such as myself, who have a declining ability to remember things, someone who would watch us when we shoot and what we shoot in, could cut the learning curve greatly.

    I don't know if he still does this but tony boyer offered seminars for a few years. It seems to me that some of the top rf shooters could make a few bucks; perhaps pay for their trips by offering shooting seminars. Wadda ya think?
    best shooting coach is yourself be honest on mistakes and keep practicing and pay close of direction and angle of daisy wind flaigs.

  7. #22
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    Jun 2014
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    75
    Are we different?
    Do we perform differently?
    Do we think differently?

    Let's look at other shooting disciplines for a moment...
    ISSF is all about coaches...
    Archery is all about coaches...
    Why benchrest is different?
    Maybe our age range is the difference... benchrest doesn't have a school, archery does, ISSF does... just to name a few.
    Maybe our declining in numbers, and not triggering the same interest among youngsters is because there's no place to learn.

    Being seasoned shooters, national champions, world champions, whatever we are, doesn't mean we don't need a coach.
    Yes, we do need a coach! We do need a person that makes us to think the basis again and again, point out the flaws and the positives. A person that anticipate our needs, fears and ambition. A person that designs a training plan and goals, and carries on the shooter to achieve, to excel.

    I think we have entered a "bad" circle towards potential coaches... the ones that exist don't want to coach us because they see persons that are too deep in their egos, not having open minds, or at least not listening. On the other hand, we are not creating a school that could developed benchrest coaches.

    Are we doomed?
    Don't think so, but I deeply believe we have to act differently to preserve the sport we love the best.

  8. #23
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    Nov 2019
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    21
    Quote Originally Posted by PedroS View Post
    That would be so nice Kent...
    I'll give a leg and a kidney, well,... maybe just a kidney, as legs are too useful for benchrest, to be on front row listening!
    Please do broadcast...
    I'll be the sponge to your left holding a clipboard and pen..

  9. #24
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    Nov 2006
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    Augusta, Maine & Palm Coast, Fl
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    Great Post!

    Quote Originally Posted by PedroS View Post
    Are we different?
    Do we perform differently?
    Do we think differently?

    Let's look at other shooting disciplines for a moment...
    ISSF is all about coaches...
    Archery is all about coaches...
    Why benchrest is different?
    Maybe our age range is the difference... benchrest doesn't have a school, archery does, ISSF does... just to name a few.
    Maybe our declining in numbers, and not triggering the same interest among youngsters is because there's no place to learn.

    Being seasoned shooters, national champions, world champions, whatever we are, doesn't mean we don't need a coach.
    Yes, we do need a coach! We do need a person that makes us to think the basis again and again, point out the flaws and the positives. A person that anticipate our needs, fears and ambition. A person that designs a training plan and goals, and carries on the shooter to achieve, to excel.

    I think we have entered a "bad" circle towards potential coaches... the ones that exist don't want to coach us because they see persons that are too deep in their egos, not having open minds, or at least not listening. On the other hand, we are not creating a school that could developed benchrest coaches.

    Are we doomed?
    Don't think so, but I deeply believe we have to act differently to preserve the sport we love the best.
    One of the biggest problems in the benchrest sports is the reluctance of those on top to share EVERYTHING. Egos do not permit it, unfortunately. There are far too many people with big hat sizes in all the Benchrest disciplines, from my experience and it's reasonably extensive. I think it does keep people away. In one case, a close friend planned to build a rifle to compete in one of the disciplines I was running matches for. He saw some ugly things going on by some of these big hat sized people and sold all the components he had amassed. He wanted nothing to do with people like this. I shoot because I enjoy it and ignore those around me. There have been times I would have welcomed someone to watch me and critique what I was or wasn't doing. At this point in my life, I just hope to wake up every day

    Pete

  10. #25
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
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    75
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete Wass View Post
    One of the biggest problems in the benchrest sports is the reluctance of those on top to share EVERYTHING. Egos do not permit it, unfortunately. There are far too many people with big hat sizes in all the Benchrest disciplines, from my experience and it's reasonably extensive. I think it does keep people away. In one case, a close friend planned to build a rifle to compete in one of the disciplines I was running matches for. He saw some ugly things going on by some of these big hat sized people and sold all the components he had amassed. He wanted nothing to do with people like this. I shoot because I enjoy it and ignore those around me. There have been times I would have welcomed someone to watch me and critique what I was or wasn't doing. At this point in my life, I just hope to wake up every day

    Pete
    Thanks Pete!

    I'm not better nor worst than others, I just do a lot of F2F trainings and virtual ones to try to develop benchrest around here. I use all international matches to talk to friends and great shooters and try to learn the more I can. Also, forums have been, alongside with a lot of emails to some special US/EU friends, a strong contribution to my learning.
    I also attend all special shooting trainings that I can, irrespective of discipline, as well as, psychological ones.
    In fact, my club , ST2, started last year the Shooting Training Academy, where I succeeded to introduce the benchrest discipline, and next friday we will broadcast the 3rd of a series about cleaning and maintenance of fire arms.
    Interesting enough, we have reach, more than 40 attendees, but just 1 or 2 benchrest shooters... go figure.

  11. #26
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    Nov 2006
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    Augusta, Maine & Palm Coast, Fl
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    I don't understand

    what the intrigue is with distance shooting, beyond 300 yards. I don't get it. The equipment demand is similar in cost I would think. I just don't understand why people want to lie on the ground to shoot. A person such as I with a bad back and a big belly, well, not comfortable at all and damn hard to get up! Perhaps the perceived "stuffyness" of BR shooters keeps folks away or they think it is way too difficult somehow. It's an interesting to think about. Perhaps asking folks on here, those who do not compete, why they don't. I'm pretty sure there are more people out there who have Benchrest guns and equipment who never go to sanctioned matches than there are people who compete. Me, i won't waste my time shooting "Club" matches ususlly but then, that's me.

    Pete

  12. #27
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    Feb 2006
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    Wilcox, PA
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by billbrawand View Post
    i think this should looked at in future.
    you will be surprise what you see.it is not one on one anymore

  13. #28
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    Apr 2003
    Location
    Wilkes County, N.C.
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    Someone touched on sharing of info from the experienced to the inexperienced. When I began shooting IR50/50 I was in a hornets nest shooting with some of the best in the game at that time. Now, that was a "good thing", but beating them wasn't going to happen. LOL I asked lots of questions, sometimes to the point I'm sure they got tired of hearing them. Mostly regarding HOW to read and judge the wind. As I became more experienced, i.e., winning now and then, I realized I was asking questions that they could not possibly answer correctly. Your rifle/ammo combination might handle wind drift better or worse than another's. So, where I thought maybe they were holding out info to maybe keep me down was wrong thinking on my part. Some things you just have to put the time and ammo in and learn. But, these things, 1-great rifle and 2- greater ammo 3- greater ammo 4-greater ammo are essential. I never went to a match where I didn't think my equipment was as good as any there, but I ALWAYS wondered who had the best ammo, and doubted it was me. When I was shooting I'd buy between 8-12 cases of ammo per season, and sell off what didn't work as well for me. Lot's of $$$ for ammo.

    I wil say the guys I used to shoot with were great shooters, and even greater people. I sure miss them all.

  14. #29
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    388

    Coaching RFBR a very difficult thing to do!

    Coaching someone, anyone, to shoot rimfire benchrest (RFBR) is a difficult thing to do. Just giving advice on how to approach a target is difficult.

    Everyone prone to shoot rimfire RFBR already knows more than everyone else that shoots RFBR. That is why you see so many arguments on the forums.

    Many of our best and most experienced shooters will not post on the forums because they know whatever they say will get trashed.

    Let me give you an example:

    How to approach a target.

    1. Start at the bottom of the target and work your way up. Reason gravity!

    2. Shoot at least 10+ sighters to lube/warm your barrel.

    3. If you are shooting a spring loaded rest, start on the side of the target that works toward your spring. Always work toward the spring. If you have a spring loaded top

    put the hard side on the right. Barrel torque!

    4. If your first target is a center punch shoot the next. If not go back to the sighters and find out why.

    If the second target is a center punch shoot the third. If not, go back to the sighters.

    If the third shot is a center punch do not be tempted to shoot that 4th target yet.

    Go to the far side of the target and shoot sighters until you are shooting center punches.

    Then work your way back shooting the 5th target, then the forth target to complete the line, always going to the sighters if not center punching.

    Shoot the rest of the target using this method.

    Note: Yes, I know, many have shot perfect targets by running through the target as fast as they can and before the conditions change.

    Yes, it can, and has been done. But that goes against the odds.

    Now we all know most of the time conditions will keep you from shooting exact center punches.

    You will have to take that in to account when you decide what is as good as you can expect.

    The idea is don't go to the next scoring target if you missed or barely hit the last scoring target. Never give away points.

    Give yourself every reason to believe you know where your next shot is going.

    Now if I haven't stirred up enough controversy I'll add one more thing that got me laughed at the first time I posted it.

    When one shoots you normally know which side the push is coming from so you hold windage to account for the push. Push has a vertical component so you must

    hold for that as well. That push is rarely constant meaning sometimes you get more, sometimes you get less.

    Your hold off may have you hitting hard 10's but not always Xs. Hitting just inside the push enough not to make an X.

    You can move your hold point and go for Xs, or you can keep your hold point and expect to keep shooting 10s with some Xs.

    It is a hard choice deciding to stay with safe side of the 10 ring or move closer to the center.

    Many times moving your hold point results in missing the 10 ring altogether.

    In IR 50 that 9 may cost you the match. Going for 10's vs Xs can be a real thing.

    Now I've spit this out there I'm sure most of the people reading this think I'm full of it, and I may be.

    But that is why coaching is so hard.

    I've got the flame suit on so bring it!

    TKH
    Last edited by tonykharper; 12-04-2020 at 11:52 AM.

  15. #30
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    Feb 2003
    Location
    San Antonio, Texas
    Posts
    2,544
    Tony:
    I've heard everyone one of those suggestions.

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