30 X 47 Load Data
I have recently purchased a used 30X47 (Savage brass) HBR with 1in18 twist barrel.
I am new to this and would greatly appreciate some starting points with regards to load development.
Powder: type & amount
bullet: type & weight
In my 30HBR (a 30x47 with a sharper shoulder) I use a BIB 136gr, 10ogive bullet in front of 42.8gr of Vit 135 powder. The Berger 135gr flat base bullet is a great second choice in my barrel. I use 300 Savage Rem brass with a CCI BR2 primer. My barrel is a Shilen 1in15 twist. It loves this load, but...yours may not. Start about 10 percent below this load and start from there. If you subscribe to "Precision Shooting" magazine the loads of the top winners are listed and there are plenty listed for 30x47's. Per experiment I don't think the primer choice makes much difference. I've used Fed match primers, Rem 9 1/2's, Wolf primers, and Win large rifle primers with good results. But...I love the little "B" letter on the CCI primer which tells me instantly what primer is in that case. Of course now that I use CCI's exclusively that no longer applies.
However, with your slow twist barrel, a lighter bullet and a different powder may be called for. Try 112gr or 118 gr BIB's, Cheek, or Bergers. Also a faster powder like Vit 133 may be called for. But...a hotter powder may not fill your case before giving pressure indications. The lighter bullets and hotter powders are more effective in the 30BR or 30ppc calibers.
I'm sure other will pipe in here to give some excellent advise as well.
Last edited by virg; 09-16-2010 at 12:34 AM.
In a 30x47 in a 18 twist barrel you will most likely still find yourself using N-135 powder. But you will want to limit yourself to bullets w jackets in the 1" range; 118's, 115's, 112's, maybe as heavy as 125's. But even 1.080 jacketted bullets will give you problems tuning. I acnnot give you a load weight, as I shoot a 30x44, but I shoot around too many 30x47's to not absorb some of the info. And cases don't make that much difference in the bullet issue. Twist rate and jacket length is the pertinent data
Originally Posted by virg
A friend told me he used 42g of H-4895 in his. It's simple to just go look at the match results on the IBS site from the home page here. There are match results with equipment lists going back a ways. Look at the equipment lists, you will see quite a few 30-47's listed in them and what they are using. I think a lot of folks use the slower powders in them but I have had pretty good results using faster powders in that type case.
Thanks to all for the great info. I can't wait to start playing with it.
Boy did I goof this up. I received the rifle today & it has a 1 in 15 twist Lilja 22" barell (not the 1 in 18 I started this post with). OOPS! sorry.
The gentelman I purchased it from was shooting 150Gr. Chism bullets with about 42 grains of Winchester 748. This load shot well for him, but I don't use
Winchester powders (I guess I can find some). Would you still recomend a 13? gr bullet & VV135?
Use bullets in the 135 gr. to 150 gr. range. Winchester 748 has proven extremely accurate in many calibers, but be prepared to chase the tune more than with stick powders since ball powders (double base) tend to change way more with temperature changes. Recommended powders are: N135, N140, Benchmark, 8208 XBR, H4895, and IMR4320. If you have never played with 4320, give it a serious look. It will meter very well, and 40 gr should be close to a good load with the 150 gr. bullet. Reloader 15 is another choice, but it is double base like ball powder even though extruded.
I have always assumed that the finicikiness of ball powders came from their design, rather than the double-base formulation. The burn rate of ball powders is pretty much controlled by the deterent coating. Variations in granular size happen, but are not really a *design* property.
Back when 748 was somewhat popular in BR circles, sifting the powder was suppose to improve grouping significantly. There were even sets of sieves sold to do this. Testing showed the sifting helped for ball powders, not so much for stick powders. Now, that could be because it is just harder to sift a stick powder, or it could be for other reasons.
I shoot double-base stick powders in long-range benchrest, and haven't found Rel-22, Rel-25, or VV N-560 for example, to be any more temperature sensitive than the single-base powders. Or so it seems.
What do we know for sure? Can you add any more light on this?
Good morning Charles,
Originally Posted by Charles E
If you compare the size and shape of various Winchester "ball" powders you might conclude that those two factors are manipulated to control burn rate. Consider 748 vs 760 for instance. Both are the same color and finish, but 760 granuals are about 50% larger than 748. Neither are balls or spheres but are significantly flattened to form little round edged hockey pucks. Both powders appear to have a significant number of particles that are more flattened than the majority that I imagine are there to adjust the basic rate toward the faster side. The same comparisons cand be made between 680 (discontinued) and 296 or 231(little pancakes) and 560. Nobody has told me this, it's just my deduction. But it seems reasonable to me that Winchester would blend their powders in this way to adjust burn rate to a standard. But it might just be a fig newton of my imagination.
Yes I would. Try Berger 135's and start with 42.5gr of V135. Work from there. Good luck....virg.
Originally Posted by zini72
All I can say is the chronograph shows a huge increase in velocity when shooting 748 at 70 deg. and then at 100 deg. I have seen a difference of close to 200 fps. The load was a 6BR with a 70 gr. and 34.5 gr. of 748. I have also found that loading to a true max with 748 below 95 deg. is not recommended.