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Thread: A different method of mounting Rail Gun barreled action.

  1. #1
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    A different method of mounting Rail Gun barreled action.

    While laying in bed the other night, I was thinking about the various methods of mounting a Barreled Action to the top of a Rail Gun Top. Barrel Blocks are the most successful it seems. And they work once you arrive at the proper tension of the clamping screws.

    For some reason, recoil lugs popped up in my head. I see thick ones on big rifles, so what if you incorporated a stress free way to mount the barreled action with a precision machined mounting block that was in reality a huge recoil lug.

    This is what I came up with. The block is machined from 17-4 PH at H 1050. It was bored and faced on the same setup to insure it is dead square. The barrel is machined to match it. The fits have .001 clearance in the bores of the block.

    The block is secured with two 3/8 24 bolts

    I’m going to try this,.....just because.

    http://benchrest.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1592528120

    http://benchrest.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1592528163

    http://benchrest.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1592528226

    http://benchrest.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1592528279

    http://benchrest.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1592528380
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  2. #2
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    Jackie,

    I'm glad to hear I'm not the only one who lays in bed at night thinking of rifles and such...

    Very interesting and inventive. I'm extremely curious as to how it will shoot. I assume the barrel is a known quantity, being a current barrel for your rail. If so, how did it shoot prior to altering for the recoil lug set-up?

    You mentioned the proper tension for barrel block screws. What would that be, approximately, in foot pounds? And is there any concern about bore distortion caused by the clamping of the barrel block?

    Justin

  3. #3
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    If a barrel is carefully slugged a UL barrel in a barrel block anything over about 65 in/lb you can feel the restriction.

    Does it effect accuracy??


    .

  4. #4
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    The barrel was the current one on my Rail and seemed to be pretty good.
    Last edited by jackie schmidt; 06-19-2020 at 07:39 AM.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by JerrySharrett View Post
    If a barrel is carefully slugged a UL barrel in a barrel block anything over about 65 in/lb you can feel the restriction.

    Does it effect accuracy??


    .
    Yes. We had a discussion quite a while back about barrel blocks, so I tested mine. Anything over 60 inch pounds and the groups opened up. I never slugged, it, but figured it was affecting the ID.

    I settled in on 25 inch pounds. I bought a little 25 inch pound “clicker” to tighten the bolts. That held it firm with the 10 5/16 28 bolts, without closing the bore.

    This thing I am doing now is just an experiment, mainly seeing if the assembly can be mounted stress free, producing more consistent performance. The barrel, a new Krieger for this season, shot pretty good. Since the block has to be made from steel or a similar material that won’t compress, weight would be an issue in anything but a large long Range Heavy Gun application.

    Here is kinda of a scale drawing of the assembly

    http://benchrest.com/attachment.php?...1&d=1592574162
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    Last edited by jackie schmidt; 06-19-2020 at 09:43 AM.

  6. #6
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    Cool Cool concept!

    You'd maybe probably get some more teeth pulled, Jackie - cool concept!RG
    P.S. R U already thinking about testing with metal-to-metal & with damper between lug and base-plate??
    Last edited by R.G. Robinett; 06-19-2020 at 09:50 AM.

  7. #7
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    Slick concept Jackie and I can't say I've seen anything like it on a rail. Please keep us posted.

    Speaking of rails, I finally finished mine this week. Hope to play with it soon. I'm going to start around 20 in/lbs and go up to 50 or 60. Quick question. Do you tune the load first, then start torquing? Or have you found it better to find the block setting first, then adjust loads?

    -Lee
    www.singleactions.com

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Martin View Post
    Slick concept Jackie and I can't say I've seen anything like it on a rail. Please keep us posted.

    Speaking of rails, I finally finished mine this week. Hope to play with it soon. I'm going to start around 20 in/lbs and go up to 50 or 60. Quick question. Do you tune the load first, then start torquing? Or have you found it better to find the block setting first, then adjust loads?

    -Lee
    www.singleactions.com
    Lee, if you torque the barrel block too tight to where it actually distort the barrel ID, no load will shoot. It amazed ho light a torque will do that. In truth, the only way you can actually ascertain this is by slugging the barre. Or shooting it

    Start at 25 inch pounds.

  9. #9
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    Well Jackie, at least someone is thinking. here are pictures of mine, last time I shot it was 2013 ubr nationals. I shot it at Kansas City nationals before that so I'm guessing 12-15 years ago.....
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  10. #10
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    Jackie,

    If your idea shows promise...

    You mentioned the block needing to be made of steel and the resulting weight issue. Do you think an aluminum lug with a pressed/pinned steel insert would be a viable alternative?

    Justin

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zebra13 View Post
    Jackie,

    If your idea shows promise...

    You mentioned the block needing to be made of steel and the resulting weight issue. Do you think an aluminum lug with a pressed/pinned steel insert would be a viable alternative?

    Justin
    The reason I mentioned steel or another high strength material is you are Putting in compression the barrel block between the action face and the shoulder of the barrel. Considering the torque involved with insuring a adequate joint, I doubt aluminum would be up to the task.

    Perhaps Titanium. But then that is getting into a whole different ball game when considering doing something just for the fun of it.

    And then, I didn’t have a big enough chunk of 7075 T-6 Aluminum laying around, but I did have this piece of 17-4 left over from a previous job.
    Last edited by jackie schmidt; 06-19-2020 at 01:36 PM.

  12. #12
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    Jackie, After looking at your sketch mine is alittle different. 4" long and I used two 1/4 " dowel pins front and rear with 6 1/4 20 screws to hold to plate. Also I went down in dia. to 1.125 the nice part is you don't need a shoulder where barrel is just thread up and use block to determine h.s..... An alum block would work fine you would need to counterbore both ends and use a steel washer maybe 1/4 " thick at both ends to sandwich alum block. The first I can recall discussing this was with Micky Coleman around 1999 we threw the idea around until I decided to try it ....

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by geo.ulrich View Post
    Well Jackie, at least someone is thinking. here are pictures of mine, last time I shot it was 2013 ubr nationals. I shot it at Kansas City nationals before that so I'm guessing 12-15 years ago.....
    This goes to prove George, nothing under the Sun is really ever new.

    Heck, this concept might be put in the closet with many of my other ideas that “seemed like a good idea at the time”. Hopefully I can get to the range Sunday and see.

    That being said, my barrel mounting block would be a great paperweight
    Last edited by jackie schmidt; 06-19-2020 at 06:07 PM.

  14. #14
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by geo.ulrich View Post
    jackie, after looking at your sketch mine is alittle different. 4" long and i used two 1/4 " dowel pins front and rear with 6 1/4 20 screws to hold to plate. Also i went down in dia. To 1.125 the nice part is you don't need a shoulder where barrel is just thread up and use block to determine h.s..... An alum block would work fine you would need to counterbore both ends and use a steel washer maybe 1/4 " thick at both ends to sandwich alum block. The first i can recall discussing this was with micky coleman around 1999 we threw the idea around until i decided to try it ....
    with all the bbls i put on rim and cf i just put piece of flashing on top and bottomof bbls in block seems to work quite well

  15. #15
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    Layman's quesstion

    First of all, I would classify myself as a layman's layman, but I find myself drawn to these discussions because they are so interesting. I mean I read the rudder shaft thread backwards and forwards. Maybe it was just the pictures. Same here maybe.
    Some things were discussed and a question immediately popped into my mind. If somewhere between 25 and 60 inch pounds of torque on a barrel block will potentially alter the inside dimension of a barrel, why wouldn't removing .201 of the o.d. also have an effect on the inside dimension. I mean everything has a cause and effect. Please enlighten me.

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