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Thread: Chambering: indicate bore before threading and/or before reamer?

  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeneT View Post
    No, the TBAS is particularly designed to take out that non-concentricity as well as lineal misalignment. If the bore were concentric to the outside and straight, a regular chuck would do (well, you'd have the gripping problem...).

    GsT
    Yep:

  2. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rubicon Prec. View Post
    Do you realize that the TBAS has nothing other than gravity acting on the opposite end of the barrel that youíre working on?

    Of course I do..... I would still use a spider at the left end to stabilize but only to take up slack


    Quote Originally Posted by Rubicon Prec. View Post


    I guess we work on different types of rifles then.


    Well, different standards anyways.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Rubicon Prec. View Post


    Iím thinking thatís because you donít quite grasp the concept of the TBAS. No harm.
    And I'm thinking I've been hearing this line since I was old enough to ask questions..... and well over a half-century of asking the hard questions has taught me exactly what the phrases "you don't understand" and "you can't understand" really means. I deal with engineers every day, for the last 40yrs.... I hire them to validate MY ideas....and have two sons who are successful mechanical engineers out in the real world working for internationally renowned companies..... I am personal friends with many others.....I "grasp it" quite well, Thank You Very Much

    And, machinists, mechanics, engineers, doctors, contractors.... I FIRE them when they're only average, when they can't grasp my questions.


    I spend my life searching for those 1/1000th-of-a-percentile people who actually U N D E R S T A N D their respective crafts... "building to spec" doesn't impress me, "improving on spec" is all I care about. The few engineers I ask questions of are first of all curious, acute and keenly proficient, even obsessive...... and they NEVER say "you couldn't understand"...

    I currently HAVE the best way to dial in and hold a barrel stress-free. Accurate, repeatable, and more importantly a system which withstands my rigorous back-checks.

    You've explained what you think is "good" and "adequate" and even "best" in your view..... I simply disagree!

    3 times I've actually had the "3D BuckChuck" in my cart to buy and 3 times I've set back and asked myself "WHAT would you possibly use this for???" And 3 times I've emptied my cart... because "dialing in a useful barrel" just ain't in it.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rubicon Prec. View Post
    ........

    I can promise there are ways to hold a barrel far more securely, and far more stress free than between 4 points at each end (regardless if itís a spider chuck or 4J with a copper wire ring contact)............



    See, here's where it always ends..... "you can promise me"........

    But like most (insert favorite pejorative here), you can't EXPLAIN nuttin, just promise.

    I HAVE a way, and an explanation of why, I even have several hours of video showing it in action.

    And I have explained it repeatedly here on BRC, and it causes nothing but arguments, and when I WATCH a guy do it, or they EXPLAIN how they do it, it soon becomes apparent that they simply DO NOT understand what Gordie came up with.






    Yes, if I do ever use one of them jackable chucks (I'll end up talking myself into one eventually) to dial in a barrel..... I WILL epoxy a pipe onto it to do it. Ain't no Bondo in it for this cat, I be DEVCON that thing together. I actually do that a lot, fixture with Hysol and other epoxies....

  3. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeneT View Post
    ...... (well, you'd have the gripping problem...).

    GsT

    Thank you Gene..... YOU get it....

    I'm not dis'ing on the freakin' chuck! I went to his youtube videos YEARS ago and complimented him effusively...

  4. #124
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    RE: gripping problem with a collet or jaw chuck on a tapered part.
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  5. #125
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    RE: gripping problem with a collet or jaw chuck on a tapered part. 2.0
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  6. #126
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    yeahh..... I use collets to make ferrules for pool cues, I suppose they'd be sufficient for folks who believe that fiberglass wrapped barrels "shoot"


    You clearly are made happy with your method.... and it makes your clients happy.....

    As I said, I Get It

    I ain't sellin' nuttin'!

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by alinwa View Post
    yeahh..... I use collets to make ferrules for pool cues, I suppose they'd be sufficient for folks who believe that fiberglass wrapped barrels "shoot"


    You clearly are made happy with your method.... and it makes your clients happy.....

    As I said, I Get It

    I ain't sellin' nuttin'!

    Has nothing to do with collets, even though far more complicated parts, with tighter tolerances, are made using them, than someone cutting a rifle chamber on a Chinese lathe in their garage.

    And FWIW, it sure seems youíve been trying to sell the ďGordyĒ method in most of your posts. I donít think Iíve even stated what method I use. Nor would I try to sell anyone on it. Maybe I am using the ďGordyĒ method, or a variant of it?

    Simply put, a bushing cut to match the taper of a barrel held in a jaw chuck or collet is far more secure and stress free than holding a barrel between 8 jacking screws.

  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rubicon Prec. View Post
    Has nothing to do with collets, even though far more complicated parts, with tighter tolerances, are made using them, than someone cutting a rifle chamber on a Chinese lathe in their garage.

    And FWIW, it sure seems youíve been trying to sell the ďGordyĒ method in most of your posts. I donít think Iíve even stated what method I use. Nor would I try to sell anyone on it. Maybe I am using the ďGordyĒ method, or a variant of it?

    Simply put, a bushing cut to match the taper of a barrel held in a jaw chuck or collet is far more secure and stress free than holding a barrel between 8 jacking screws.
    Oh I'm not selling it, I just think Gordy came up with a good solution for dealing with crooked bores..... and more importantly, for making identical chambers.....so good that YES, I did buy a Chinese lathe for my garage based entirely on his method. I couldn't get anyone else to do it, Gordy was out two years on barreling jobs, so I bought a lathe.

    And I believe strongly in giving credit where credit is due.

    I would never cut a tapered bushing to hold a barrel, even with a jackable chuck. So yeahh, we disagree

    Now, you show me a jackable chuck which will grip a taper and I'll buy one. And I'll give you credit for showing me a better way.

    And I do have an American made collet machine, in my "garage"

    And as far as "cutting good chambers"...... I've been buying my own reamers for 35yrs and sending them to gunsmiths all over the country. And then having to buy a sizing die for each barrel. I've got 9 worn out barrels in the bin all cut with the same reamer, 4 different gunsmiths, they all "shoot" (or "shot") , some better than others, but I also have 3 different dies and a stack of Skip's shims and a notebook of settings......Now I can (did, in the last match, trying out a different gun during a relay) interchange brass from barrel to barrel full length sizing every time. The 56 cases I'm loading tomorrow have already been used in 5 different barrels....

    I did pop the neck off of a case a couple weeks ago. It only had 18 firings on it. In only 3 barrels.

    And the neck came out with a cleaning brush.

  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rubicon Prec. View Post
    Has nothing to do with collets, even though far more complicated parts, with tighter tolerances, are made using them, than someone cutting a rifle chamber on a Chinese lathe in their garage.
    I'm just saving this to remind myself...... "Al, would you just SHUT UP already? This isn't fruitful discussion"



    I know better....

  10. #130
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    BTW, this is not and never has been "about you" Rubi..... I'm sorry to have been drawn along in my passion to present information to the masses.

    This is an information forum, and while I enjoy passionate and personal discourse, The Others.......


    don't




    apologies all

  11. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by alinwa View Post
    BTW, this is not and never has been "about you" Rubi..... I'm sorry to have been drawn along in my passion to present information to the masses.

    This is an information forum, and while I enjoy passionate and personal discourse, The Others.......


    don't




    apologies all
    Oh, I am fully aware it is not about me. In fact, I make a point not to say what method I use. My point is, and always will be, people should understand why they are using a method, and check it to see if there are inherent flaws with it, such as bending the barrel or falsely thinking they are timing a barrel with a muzzle up/down attitude.

    If you set up a barrel to you are ready to chamber, put a Sharpie mark at the muzzle end and chamber end, run a DTI on those Sharpie marks, document the readings, mark the high spot, then remove the barrel and reset it up so you are ready to chamber again, if your reading at the Sharpie marks are not what they were the first time, you ARE bending the barrel in your setup.

    Does bending a barrel really matter? In reality, probably not much. But, if you are bending a barrel, are you fooling yourself that you method is really any better than working between centers/using the reamer as a center?

    I'd rather people think for themselves and understand why they are doing something, rather than going in blind because the internet said this is how to do something.

  12. #132
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    Did you mean Carbon Fiber wrapped barrels Al.

  13. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Louis.J View Post
    Did you mean Carbon Fiber wrapped barrels Al.
    LOL, sure.....

    I mean "resin painted barrels with some sort of fibers in"

    I refuse to dignify them with "Carbon Fiber Wrapped" because that gives a sense of panache to a stupid concept.

    I say "CF barrel" in the same tone as I say "EV transportation"

  14. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rubicon Prec. View Post
    Oh, I am fully aware it is not about me. ...........

    .............I'd rather people think for themselves and understand why they are doing something, rather than going in blind because the internet said this is how to do something.
    Well thank you for that. I've been on this forum since the early '90's and have pissed off a lot of people by being frank.

    NOT by being RIGHT..... just for speaking my mind.

    I 'felt' like you were getting a little warm around the edges based on your reply but am seriously glad for your explanation in this last post.





    I got over 5hrs of video.....in the can

  15. #135
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    Rubicon Prec

    I want to thank you

    You spurred me to start a project (reluctantly) which has morphed into something very useful..... I've learned some stuff, particularly about the efficacy of 'nutting' barrels which blew me away. Unfortunately for this thread the stuff has absolutely nothing to do with "bending or binding barrels, or putting them into tension in the lathe" but it's taught me something nonetheless.

    It's been worth it after all. "I'm a better person because of it"

    Might even have "built me some character" LOL

    Soooo..... off work early again (actually, just abandoned my crews and am off playing the Boss Card) and I'm going down to video some more..... I be SHOW some barrel bending in the fixture, be SHOW deflection and measure it quantitatively and probably SHOW my findings re barrel nuts....

    Meantime, let it be said, Gordy Gritters is Da' MAN!! in my book...... this stuff repeats like Clockwork Orange ....... like bad fish..... OVER and OVER..... only it leaves a pleasant taste....

    I be e'CITED!

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