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Thread: Nbrsa

  1. #16
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    Oct 2017
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    Southwest PA
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    Quote Originally Posted by jackie schmidt View Post

    Multitudes of shooters do that.
    I obviously went to the wrong group match then Jackie. I have all the gear. Gear isn't an issue. I was already in the rabbit hole. My main reason for attending was to further my knowledge and up my game by interacting with top tier shooters. After 2 days of practice and 2 days of competition the biggest thing I learned is that it's every man for himself and you are either part of the inner circle or you are on the outside looking in. Whatever I learned there I learned on my own. In spite of that, I had a pretty good time anyway just seeing how I stacked up against the experts. I just re-upped my membership for next year, so I'll see how it goes.

  2. #17
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
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    1,416
    Quote Originally Posted by jimmymac View Post
    I obviously went to the wrong group match then Jackie. I have all the gear. Gear isn't an issue. I was already in the rabbit hole. My main reason for attending was to further my knowledge and up my game by interacting with top tier shooters. After 2 days of practice and 2 days of competition the biggest thing I learned is that it's every man for himself and you are either part of the inner circle or you are on the outside looking in. Whatever I learned there I learned on my own. In spite of that, I had a pretty good time anyway just seeing how I stacked up against the experts. I just re-upped my membership for next year, so I'll see how it goes.

    Good for you Jimmymac! That's the right attitude to take. Good luck with your shooting.

    Sincerely,

    Gene Beggs

  3. #18
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    Feb 2003
    Location
    Houston, Texas
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    7,034
    Quote Originally Posted by jimmymac View Post
    I obviously went to the wrong group match then Jackie. I have all the gear. Gear isn't an issue. I was already in the rabbit hole. My main reason for attending was to further my knowledge and up my game by interacting with top tier shooters. After 2 days of practice and 2 days of competition the biggest thing I learned is that it's every man for himself and you are either part of the inner circle or you are on the outside looking in. Whatever I learned there I learned on my own. In spite of that, I had a pretty good time anyway just seeing how I stacked up against the experts. I just re-upped my membership for next year, so I'll see how it goes.
    I wasn't talking about at Matches. I was talking about when I am at my local club testing and practicing.
    Last edited by jackie schmidt; 11-10-2018 at 02:58 PM.

  4. #19
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
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    889
    Quote Originally Posted by jackie schmidt View Post
    I wasn't talking about at Matches. I was talking about when I am at my local club testing and practicing.
    Jimmy was specific in stating that he showed up for a match, a big match as I recall, and was pretty much ignored by those who already had a handle on what was going on. Frequently those who have an interest in our sport don't have anyone at their local club to learn from and their only option is to attend a match. I believe the kind of attitude he encountered is common among Benchrest (capital B) shooters and is one of the major reason the sport is stagnant. If we want our sport to grow it is crucial that each of us act as an ambassador. If you are not actively helping and encouraging new shooters you are not being part of the solution.


    Rick

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
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    S.E. MI
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimmymac View Post
    Maybe take the time to help a new guy when he shows up at a match instead of being self absorbed in your own ventures. If you do that, maybe the new guy will actually come back.
    Jimmy there's a lot of watchers.
    At the matches, It's hard to tell a watcher or a shooter....Then there's the phone call out of the blue......Then there are your own club members....they all like to talk. And I talk to them all.....it's funny at the "Club Show and Tell". Talk to 50 people. And the kids sound more interested...can't get the parents to drive the kids out to the club.....

    And Yes. I have helped a lot of guys git in to Benchrest.

    I have come to the conclusion, that the "Family(WIVES)" have the most to do with low participation.....the common reason for not showing up is the Wife had something to do.....if there is nothing on the calendar, then the husband can go out to the club.....
    Even though the shooting calendar is made out in January.....

    Yep. I am a little burned out. Trying to get new guys in the sport.
    Last guy. Sold him one of my good rifles. Then he hooks up with the other "Rifle Committee" guys.
    At this club. Benchrest is called Precision Shooting, so we compete against the other Rifle guys...
    Man, that rifle tracked great.....

    JMHO

    By the way. I am a member at 3 clubs and shoot at 6 or 7 through out the year.....Run Score Matches at WWCCA and help with Group...
    Last edited by zippy06; 11-10-2018 at 09:27 PM.

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Dunwoody, Georgia
    Posts
    54
    With all due respect, I don’t think family obligations are the cause of what ails the sport.

    The issue we face is not simply low participation; it’s declining participation. Family obligations are nothing new. They’ve always been present and I don’t think they’ve increased in the last ten years. And family obligations are just as present in the lives of people who shoot other sports.

    I think there are two principal causes for declining participation. One is the advent of other shooting sports. The other, I think, is what was mentioned above: the barriers to entry. Expensive rifle(s), multiple barrels, lots of ancillary gear, figuring out the intricacies of developing a competitive load.

    I presume this has been brought up before but I’ll suggest it anyway: what about factory and modified classes? They seem to be popular in Ultimate Benchrest.

    Dave Rabin

  7. #22
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    SW Kansas
    Posts
    576
    I don't believe a factory or modified gun is the answer. There are many types of "benchrest"
    but for the most part on this forum most are talking about SP,LV,HV,UL guns.
    And most are striving to shoot the smallest groups possible. BR has evolved tremendously over the years.
    Let's compare BR to Top Fuel racing for example. It used to be you could get a old 392 hemi, slap a blower on it put it in a chassis and go racing. There were a lot of guys in top fuel in the old days. Nowadays sometimes it's hard to fill all the slots. Why is that? Todays TF is CNC'd blocks,heads carbon fiber parts, special rear ends, 6 disc clutches, the list goes on and on. IS that a bad thing? I don't think so, it's just guys wanting to run the fastest cars on the planet.
    It's just the evolution on the sport.

    Now on to BR. Back in the day look at how many 98 mausers were on the firing line, plus other factory actions. Now we have CNC'd actions, carbon fiber stocks, great optics,triggers,bullets, and the list goes on and on. But look how the aggs have shrunk over the years. iT'S just guys wanting to shoot the smallest groups on the planet. It's just the evolution on the sport.
    It's what this type of Benchrest is all about. Yes, it's expensive, time consuming, somedays it fun, somedays you want to pack it in.
    There is nothing wrong with factory or modified guns but speaking for myself if I had a rifle that only would shoot in the threes at it's very best that would not be very appealing at all.
    On getting new shooters, it's all about baby steps. You don't need the whole shebang to get started. Don't overwhelm them at the first. Get them started and mentor them as they progress.
    Some will take hold and get the things they need. Some will not. Just the way it is and far as I can see.

    Richard
    Last edited by Richard; 11-11-2018 at 08:51 AM.

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Posts
    8

    bad experience

    Quote Originally Posted by jimmymac View Post
    I obviously went to the wrong group match then Jackie. I have all the gear. Gear isn't an issue. I was already in the rabbit hole. My main reason for attending was to further my knowledge and up my game by interacting with top tier shooters. After 2 days of practice and 2 days of competition the biggest thing I learned is that it's every man for himself and you are either part of the inner circle or you are on the outside looking in. Whatever I learned there I learned on my own. In spite of that, I had a pretty good time anyway just seeing how I stacked up against the experts. I just re-upped my membership for next year, so I'll see how it goes.
    jimmymac,

    I'm sorry to hear that. I went to my first NBRSA match this past summer, in the Eastern Region, and I had so much fun I went to 4 more before the season was over. At every match I attended, everyone was very friendly and helpful. Always willing to answer my questions and give advice. If anything, I get too much advice... 10 different opinions on the same topic. lol. Most guys not only love to shoot but love talking about their rifles, gear, experience... so I'm very surprised you did not have the same experience that I had. I hope you give it another shot (pun intended).

    Regarding the growth of short range benchrest and the NBRSA... I dont think its the cost or the time. I dont think we need to add classes, or make any drastic changes to the rules. I think the best thing we can do is get people exposed and help new shooters that do show interest. Its a very small percentage of the "gun community" that'll be willing to do whatever it takes to shoot the smallest groups possible. That's fine. We just need to make sure that small group of people gets exposed to NBRSA matches and keeps coming back. How do we do that?

    Brian

  9. #24
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    122
    As a newer shooter in this sport (3-4 years). I have been blessed with being able to have amazing local shooters give me great advice. Some are world record holders and one was a worlds champion. I went to a match to watch and to be honest I think I was a tad bit of a pain in the ass with all the questions and hovering around. But one shooter asked me if I wanted to shoot. And the club let him sit behind me and some what coach me. I was hooked bought everything and was shooting the next match.

    BUT!!! NOT A ONE could keep me from getting sucked into the “flavor of the month” club. I was “upgrading” this and that and honestly I was loosing interest because I was spinning my wheels. I have since took a step back and went back to the basics. I have actually sold B&A triggers and went back to Jewels because I saw no change. My rest and bags works for ALL the shooting venues I do. I went thru my range stuff and if I have never used it I leave it at home.

    We are our worst enemies!!! Some of you folks dont want to see that but we are. Lets face it my generation (I turned 45 yesterday) and younger are in debt and they tend to have to “compete with the Jones” so they see Neil Jones powder measures, fancy presses and some of the other neat toys you see in the reloading shacks let alone whats on the bench and start to pull away right then and there. When I am talking to someone at the range who seems interested I always tell them I was my worst emeny and didnt need to buy/swap out/ upgrade to harldy any of the stuff I have. My ebay Redding powder measure, Bald Eagle arbor press, used RCBS press, used seater and sizer dies worked just fine and all cost me less then my Chargemaster.

    So keep that in the back of your mind when you have a sportsman showing interest.

    Rant off

  10. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Tennessee
    Posts
    6,373

    And thus the cost of progress...

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    I don't believe a factory or modified gun is the answer. There are many types of "benchrest"
    .................
    Now on to BR. Back in the day look at how many 98 mausers were on the firing line, plus other factory actions. Now we have CNC'd actions, carbon fiber stocks, great optics,triggers,bullets, and the list goes on and on. But look how the aggs have shrunk over the years. iT'S just guys wanting to shoot the smallest groups on the planet. It's just the evolution on the sport.
    It's what this type of Benchrest is all about. Yes, it's expensive, time consuming, somedays it fun, somedays you want to pack it in.
    .......
    On getting new shooters, it's all about baby steps. You don't need the whole shebang to get started. Don't overwhelm them at the first. Get them started and mentor them as they progress.
    Some will take hold and get the things they need. Some will not. Just the way it is and far as I can see.

    Richard
    Smaller aggs, lower ET's...and increased cost is the price we pay.

    Lets face another fact also, IBS and NBRSA group shooters. Most younger folks, raising families, buying homes to raise these families in, just can't afford the cost, let alone the time for 10 day events. The FISS Super Shoot, or the nationals, 6 days of competition plus a early arrival of 3-4 days for setup and practice.

    30 days, plus travel, if you just shoot both nationals and the Super Shoot. Most working folks don't get 30 days of vacation.

    There was a time we could retire at 62. Now Social Security doesn't come till 70. Retiring at 62, family raised, one could shoot these events. Not today.


    .

  11. #26
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    35

    Smile A sideliner's view.....

    Quote Originally Posted by Greyfox View Post
    Jimmy was specific in stating that he showed up for a match, a big match as I recall, and was pretty much ignored by those who already had a handle on what was going on. Frequently those who have an interest in our sport don't have anyone at their local club to learn from and their only option is to attend a match. I believe the kind of attitude he encountered is common among Benchrest (capital B) shooters and is one of the major reason the sport is stagnant. If we want our sport to grow it is crucial that each of us act as an ambassador. If you are not actively helping and encouraging new shooters you are not being part of the solution.


    Rick
    I've contemplated joining the NBRSA for a couple years now. And after reading this thread I wanted to add my thoughts as an "outsider". I and a few other shooters can identify with jimmymac's and Rick's post that is quoted above. It does get old, and does not bolster one's confidence to join an organization or club where it appears that there is discord amongst the members, and probably the club officials are at odds. I'm pleased and encouraged to see the original post, and ones like Rick's.

    That other "stuff" has to be classified as a thing of the past and lets move on to bigger and better things. So, I and at least half a dozen shooters that I know of that are not members are still watching to see what happens here and if it does go in a positive direction. See the last 2 sentences in Rick's post. I totally agree with that.

    I was going to attend an NBRSA match a few hours from here and when I called to get the particulars I was told that " we'd love to have ya attend and be prepared to have your a$$ handed to ya". While I accepted this as a challenge (my skin is pretty thick), I'm not sure that was the way I'd want someone to encourage a new shooter that he'd never met. So that's why I can identify with jimmymac's experience.

    Just my humble opinion for what it's worth. WD

  12. #27
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Colorado
    Posts
    117
    Quote Originally Posted by WyleWD View Post
    I've contemplated joining the NBRSA for a couple years now. And after reading this thread I wanted to add my thoughts as an "outsider". I and a few other shooters can identify with jimmymac's and Rick's post that is quoted above. It does get old, and does not bolster one's confidence to join an organization or club where it appears that there is discord amongst the members, and probably the club officials are at odds. I'm pleased and encouraged to see the original post, and ones like Rick's.

    That other "stuff" has to be classified as a thing of the past and lets move on to bigger and better things. So, I and at least half a dozen shooters that I know of that are not members are still watching to see what happens here and if it does go in a positive direction. See the last 2 sentences in Rick's post. I totally agree with that.

    I was going to attend an NBRSA match a few hours from here and when I called to get the particulars I was told that " we'd love to have ya attend and be prepared to have your a$$ handed to ya". While I accepted this as a challenge (my skin is pretty thick), I'm not sure that was the way I'd want someone to encourage a new shooter that he'd never met. So that's why I can identify with jimmymac's experience.

    Just my humble opinion for what it's worth. WD
    I've been doing this for a few years now and have to say that allowances have to be made for other peoples personalities. You find a lot of guys in BR that are the salt of the earth and some others that aren't. Gravitate to the one's you like and avoid the one's you don't, it's just like Church.

  13. #28
    Join Date
    Jun 2018
    Posts
    8
    Quote Originally Posted by WyleWD View Post
    I've contemplated joining the NBRSA for a couple years now. And after reading this thread I wanted to add my thoughts as an "outsider". I and a few other shooters can identify with jimmymac's and Rick's post that is quoted above. It does get old, and does not bolster one's confidence to join an organization or club where it appears that there is discord amongst the members, and probably the club officials are at odds. I'm pleased and encouraged to see the original post, and ones like Rick's.

    That other "stuff" has to be classified as a thing of the past and lets move on to bigger and better things. So, I and at least half a dozen shooters that I know of that are not members are still watching to see what happens here and if it does go in a positive direction. See the last 2 sentences in Rick's post. I totally agree with that.

    I was going to attend an NBRSA match a few hours from here and when I called to get the particulars I was told that " we'd love to have ya attend and be prepared to have your a$$ handed to ya". While I accepted this as a challenge (my skin is pretty thick), I'm not sure that was the way I'd want someone to encourage a new shooter that he'd never met. So that's why I can identify with jimmymac's experience.

    Just my humble opinion for what it's worth. WD
    I'm sure this was playful banter but it's probably not far from the truth. There's a steep learning curve and the competition is tough, but I've had nothing but great experiences in every match I've attended, no matter where I finished in the standings.

    Forget all the forum drama and negative comments. If you like benchrest shooting and can get away for a weekend, you need to come out to a match!

    I see you're in Ohio as well. The Shelby Co match is probably not far from you. Please come out to the next Eastern Region match you can and bring your friends! Most of the guys I shot with this year go out of their way to make sure you have everything you need and will help however they can. I shot all year without my own flags. I'm new but pm me if you have any questions.

    Brian

  14. #29
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Central Ohio
    Posts
    35

    Thanks and...

    Quote Originally Posted by B_Rob85 View Post
    I'm sure this was playful banter but it's probably not far from the truth. There's a steep learning curve and the competition is tough, but I've had nothing but great experiences in every match I've attended, no matter where I finished in the standings.

    Forget all the forum drama and negative comments. If you like benchrest shooting and can get away for a weekend, you need to come out to a match!

    I see you're in Ohio as well. The Shelby Co match is probably not far from you. Please come out to the next Eastern Region match you can and bring your friends! Most of the guys I shot with this year go out of their way to make sure you have everything you need and will help however they can. I shot all year without my own flags. I'm new but pm me if you have any questions.

    Brian
    I agree, that it probably was playful banter, but to someone a little shy or timid.... it could have gone another way. Again, I wasn't offended by it at all.

    And yes I'll get to the first one my schedule allows me to, I nearly attended John's match at Shelby county in October but couldn't get my equipment wired up in time to make it. John's a good fella, I've shot with him a couple times. WD

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