IR5050 Sporter Shooting vs Old Eyes

[1holer]

I am 80 years old with macular degeneration in my eyes which has become a problem with my Leupold 4.5-14 factory converted to target dot and fine crosshair. I experience eye strain after 1 match. I wanted to shoot in the sporter Nationals last year, but I knew my eyes would not hold up for (6) targets. I love sporter shooting with it's challenges so I was disparate to find a solution to my problem. I went through my sack of scopes searching for something that would work. I found a Weaver 4-16 with a Duplex reticle. I found the center crosshairs were actually fine crosshairs same as other fine crosshair scopes. You only think of Duplex reticles for hunting scopes, but in this case it funnels your vision down to the center of the fine crosshair. My problem has been with small dots you have to search for it after recoil against all the black on the target. I don't think the crosshair center is any bigger then the dot on the Leupold. I could easily aim at different places in the center white. After (6) targets I didn't feel a lot of eye strain with this scope. This scope also has parallax adjustment. I did not score well in the Sporter Nationals which I think was an ammo problem.
The next day in the (6) gun I shot a 250-15X in yards and lost to Hornstein by 1X for 2nd place. In meters TKH and I each had 249-11X, but I lost on FM. I'm not bragging on my shooting, but I did want to illustrate 80 yr. old's can still shoot sporters if they can see the target with the right scope. I am hoping "old timers" that have quit. or those having trouble shooting sporters would give this a try. God only knows we need shooters in IR5050.
The Weaver Classic 4-16 is the best scope I have found for this application. I have owned at least (10) of these scopes and I consider them outstanding for the money. Unfortunately they have discontinued making them. Mine weighs 15.2oz with caps off which compares to my Leupold. The other medium power with parallax adjustment scopes are heavier. Maybe a 3-9 scope without parallax would work, but I don't know at this time. I will look into it when the weather warms up.
I just hope some "old timers with eye problems" would give this a try. You won't have to miss out on all the fun we are having.
Gene Stroyan

 

[tim]

Gene, usually the solution involves getting the best quality optic for a sporter but you are already there IMHO . No substitue for that scopes clarity and 30mm side focus unless it has been compromised.
Noboy’s eyes get better and 80 makes it tough.
I would offer this as a possible solution regarding eye strain, train yourself to utilize the same system Bruce does regarding optics. He has posted on this but it boils down to using a big dot, as in big, like 3/4 minute. He shoots it like a receiver sight centering it within the large black ring. Obviously it would take a learning curve but it strikes me as a huge reduction in eye strain and he obviously proves the merit of the approach.
I’ll tell you what, in the same circumstances, that sure as hell is what I’d probably do.

 

[1holer]

Thanks Tim. When I first started shooting back in 2006 they talked about a good sporter shooter who shot with a 1/2" dot. I'll try to find out who it was. I'm going to shoot as long as I can, even if I have to use an elephant scope.
1holer

 

[PedroS]

Very nice to hear Gene.
At 80 shooting IS with macular degeneration is something. For the ones that don't know, macular degeneration affects central view, that's acuity vision.
And you focus on another very important point, being relaxed during shooting. The more relaxed you are the best you'll shoot, vision related.
IS is much like shooting open sights, so you have to know how to center the sight, zone aiming off, and totally believing your gear and your wind reading ability.
And you push me to try dual reticles... I have looked to them for a long time, but, and because my eyes are younger, I can still shoot with dots.
The other struggle is finding good 1/8 click scopes that have those reticles...

 

[MaxxPower]

I would offer this as a possible solution regarding eye strain, train yourself to utilize the same system Bruce does regarding optics. He has posted on this but it boils down to using a big dot, as in big, like 3/4 minute. He shoots it like a receiver sight centering it within the large black ring. Obviously it would take a learning curve but it strikes me as a huge reduction in eye strain and he obviously proves the merit of the approach.

Tim, sorry if I my earlier posts on this were misleading but I'll have to correct you on that.

I use a very small dot and stay away from the center of the target. I find it to be a very large white area and unless things are going just right it's too easy to not be perfectly centered each shot. I hold down in the black rings (the new target only has 2 rings instead of 3 and I'm still trying to get used to that. Some days are easier than others.) If I make my dot "kiss" the bottom of the black I know I'm centered and then I elevate for my hold. Using this method and the black rings I can get 4 or 5 holds that I can duplicate perfectly each time.

I will say that the new targets smaller sighters are especially helpful with my small dot. I use them to show any left/righ drift (especially important at Piney Hill). I can center my dot in it and just leave a small sliver around it so I know I'm dead on. My shots POI will be above the sighter and I can see if there's any horizontal creeping in. At PH this can change row by row.

Gene, I'd offer one other suggestion to also help. Using covers front and back with small holes really cuts down on my eye strain. SOOOO much light comes in when you're seeing almost the entire target and the only on that matters is the one that you're shooting.

Bruce Hornstein

 

[High Noon]

Weaver V16 & V24 scopes

I recommended and sold a lot of these Weaver V16 & V24 scopes over the years. For those shooters who couldn’t quite afford the Leupolds they were my recommended second choice. The optics are quite good and they have excellent adjustments. I also have several mounted on high end Cooper rifles as they match the Cooper matte finish to a tee! They have served me very well on long range woodchuck Safaris too. However, recently I’ve gotten into a little informal precision 10 meter air rifle bench rest shooting with a few older guys ( like me…lol..). I started looking at all my scopes I had and wouldn’t you know it the Weaver V16 was the only one that the parallax would adjust to ten meters. The duplex crosshair is just perfect at this distance. I do have one with a 1/4” dot I’m going to try soon. Funny thing one of my friends came to shoot with some special $2800 Leupold and after looking at my Weaver V16 he has since found a used one and changed his scope. The Weavers V series are excellent scopes and sad like many Leupold scopes that have been discontinued. These companies never cease to amaze me with sticking their heads in the sand. Like the beautiful gloss Leupold rimfire scopes that are perfect for all those rich blued classic rifles now long discontinued. It seems that now I’m always chasing these fine scopes down for some serious money the same scopes that I had sitting on the shelves years ago. Shame on these scope companies! High Noon

 

[tim]

Tim, sorry if I my earlier posts on this were misleading but I'll have to correct you on that.

I use a very small dot and stay away from the center of the target. I find it to be a very large white area and unless things are going just right it's too easy to not be perfectly centered each shot. I hold down in the black rings (the new target only has 2 rings instead of 3 and I'm still trying to get used to that. Some days are easier than others.) If I make my dot "kiss" the bottom of the black I know I'm centered and then I elevate for my hold. Using this method and the black rings I can get 4 or 5 holds that I can duplicate perfectly each time.

I will say that the new targets smaller sighters are especially helpful with my small dot. I use them to show any left/righ drift (especially important at Piney Hill). I can center my dot in it and just leave a small sliver around it so I know I'm dead on. My shots POI will be above the sighter and I can see if there's any horizontal creeping in. At PH this can change row by row.

Gene, I'd offer one other suggestion to also help. Using covers front and back with small holes really cuts down on my eye strain. SOOOO much light comes in when you're seeing almost the entire target and the only on that matters is the one that you're shooting.

Bruce Hornstein

Sorry about that, thanks for the clarification. Good tip of the reduction cover. You likely know, March offers them standard with their BR scopes.
Now I gotta figure out who the big dot guy is.

 

[doclu60]

Refreshing thread!

This is a cool thread, thank you Gene for starting it.

I consider Gene a good friend of mine and shoot with him a lot during our outdoor season. I have also feared loosing him on the firing line because of his eye issues, which I have been familiar with before his posting here. My point in bringing this up is there is a continuing decline in IR50/50 3-gun competitors and Sporter seems to be the driver of said decline. I shoot both main sanctioning bodies and enjoy both, but I really love IR 3-gun. Unfortunately, there are only 2 clubs in our area that shoot IR 3-gun and I end up shooting more ARA because of available ranges hosting events. If I could shoot IR 3-gun 4-5 times a month with the same travel time as I can shoot ARA UL, 3-gun would win that decision hands down.

I had a personal tutorial from Bruce at the first 'Iron Man' tournament about his method of combating eye fatigue shooting Sporter. He uses a lens cap, both front and back on his scope, with a small hole to look through. I will admit, there would be a learning curve implementing his method, but there is no doubt it can be done. I know, I was a referee at that tournament and had to sign a bunch of targets for his world record performance to be sent in for validation.

Then there is Gene's approach, which worked very well for him at the outdoor nationals. We, who shoot against Gene several times a month, already feared him when Sporter class came up. Now, something more in his bag of tricks to be more competitive! I am so happy he is finding his enthusiasm coming back to him. Gene is just great to compete with.

I hope some of our shooters with vision issues will read this thread and see there are things that could be done to still enjoy the game and whip the issues of the 6.5X thing in Sporter. Kudos to Gene and Bruce both for them enlightening others there are different approaches to keep those with vision issues competitive.

Scott