indicating die blanks

A

alinwa

oft dis'd member
Any tricks or cool setups for indicating the id of die blanks prior to drilling/boring/reaming?

My "Gordie Bars" aren't working so very-very hot for indicating die blanks altho I have cobbled a workaround for them.

Other than the bars I've got a rube goldberg'd rocker setup that's got enough lash in it that I've got to pre-tension it like a mousetrap.

Looking to indicate the id, not stick a rod into the die.

looking for KISS methods.....

tx
al
 
al,
thread std dies or br arbor press type..

if threaded..why not do the od as a indicated surface...

if a br bushing are they pre cut for the bushing..can you tool up from theat end ??....or a mandrel from that end ??

mike in co
 
This works for me..

This is not the cheapest method but works very well indeed..

IMG_1875_zps21104323.jpg


Cheers
leeroy
 
Al,

Could you chuck the die up in an adjustable chuck (4 jaw/adjust thru), tap it in straight (running the idicator back and forth in the i.d. to check), and than adjust out the runnout? I think Jackie trues 700's using this method, or something similar. It's KISS...

Using a precision hammer to tap will undoubtedly help.

Justin
 
Thanks guys! Great ideas and methods.

Leeroy, yes, this is basically where I'm at too...... the 2.75" long stem indicator is about the best all-round fix for my dilemma. My only problem is that I want to be able to run into, and past, the throat area on large cartridges. The die blanks I'm using are tapered in their bores and somewhat inconsistent.

Bottom line is, I'm trying to get an accurate indication beyond where the stem will reach and I'm not completely convinced that the die bores are straight. Right now I just extrapolate and hope they are. Also, I've only cut simple dies, I deprime in another step, next step is complete and adjustable setups..... gotta' get 'em straight for boring, THEN ' flip 'em end-for-end and re-indicate them to straight again..... Also, I plan on hardening them and would like to be able to check them over for warpage.I've got an adequate jacking system, just can't come up with a really good way to indicate deeper than 3"


BTW, Everybody else I know does this by screwing the doggone thing in and out of fixtures and calling it good :)

Sometimes it'd be easier to be ever'body else!!

al-anal-inwa
 
This is the indicator I use for chambers and dies. The extended round body on the indicator allows me to indicate the throat area on nearly all short action cartridges with the standard point. I just blast a clearance hole in the chamber area up to the shoulder that will allow the indicator body in. When I used to use chamber reamers I would bore the clearance hole true up to the shoulder prior to reaming. You could put a longer point on it to reach the longer chambers. I don't like long points if I can help it.
 

Attachments

  • IMG-20130313-00254.jpg
    IMG-20130313-00254.jpg
    47.6 KB · Views: 264
How about turning a mandrel with a boss that fits snuggly in the Die bushing bore that extends far enough into the die body to indicate ?
 
I THINK that is what i said....chuck the body, dial in and knock out the madnrel...

need to decide how much under current body hole for the lenght of the mandrel..so the existing hole does not influence the input from the bushing hole...


mike in co

JRM850 said:
How about turning a mandrel with a boss that fits snuggly in the Die bushing bore that extends far enough into the die body to indicate ?
Click to expand...
 
I havent done a die yet but i think i will build something similar to whats used to true rem 700 actions. A simple steel tube with 4 jack screws. Lee
 
Yes Skeet, that's what I've set up..... actually two of them, a small one for dies and a long one for actions.

It's painfully time consuming to dial them in using a mandrel setup so I will continue to indicate the bores.

al
 
I did my first seater die last year and could not believe how aggravating it was trying to indicate the short piece in the 8 screw spider. I was almost ready to give up and took a break for a day and came back to finish it.
I did as Joe spoke of using a small diameter indicator and prebored the hole, then finished after getting it straight.

OH, then pull it out of the fixture and turn it around and start all over again. After doing my first one, I didn't feel so bad about paying a friend $75 for my other seater he made for me a few years ago.

Joe Hynes
 
Dumb question:
What if you secured (set screws?) the blank inside a reasonably close fitting piece of tubing, that was long enough to put through the headstock (using a 4 jaw and an outboard spider, just like you would a barrel), doing all of the indicating from the inboard side, letting the outboard end of the tube go where it needs to?
Boyd
 
Boyd, it's too difficult to get the die set straight enough initially..... the tube would be hitting the sides of the headstock bore.
 
If the ID of the tube was a slip fit for the die OD. and the tube became a smaller diameter rod back of the die, I would think that it might be possible. Related questions...What is the measurement from tips of your chuck's jaws to the place where the ID of the spindle starts? If the entire length of the die holding tube was outside of the spindle, and that part that was inside it was a rod of say .9 dia., then spindle ID clearance would cease to be an issue.
 
Last edited:
How about making a lever with stylus ball on one end of the fulcrum and contacting a dial indicator on the other. You can make the lever as long as you want and with the same length on either side of the fulcrum, the dial indicator will read one-to-one.

Cheers,
Keith
 
Indicating "Die Blanks"

I do blanks with a steady rest.....and soft jaws..... check with indicator....no pre-drill...no pre-bore..... ream only....
 
mks said:
How about making a lever with stylus ball on one end of the fulcrum and contacting a dial indicator on the other. You can make the lever as long as you want and with the same length on either side of the fulcrum, the dial indicator will read one-to-one.

Cheers,
Keith
Click to expand...

That's exactly what my Goldberged setup is, problem with all the monkey motion is hysterisis, hence the preload.





Spake wi' Da' Kiff and he's sending me a block of appropriate bushings.....this 'should' fix me up, allow me to Gordy the setup.

Right now what I do is insert a ground rod into my tailstock chuck. I slide the die onto this (slip-fit) rod, which brings it to within just a few thou of center-of-chuck, and slide the whole apparatus into the 4-jaw. I carefully run the cathead bolts in to touch and drag the tailstock away. Now it's just a matter of fine tuning the alignment using readings taken from inside the bore.

Sounds simple.....and with a 4" long-stem unobtanium indicator it would be :)

The fitted bushings should make it so,

I hope

al
 
alinwa said:
That's exactly what my Goldberged setup is, problem with all the monkey motion is hysterisis, hence the preload.
Click to expand...
Yes, I can imagine the problem. Jewelled bearings, like inside the indicator, might work. But I also have this idea in my head about using a thin sheet of spring steel as a fulcrum instead of a bearing. This way, the only hysteresis should come from the indicator itself. They do this sort of thing for micromanipulators to move small distances under a microscope.
 
mks said:
Yes, I can imagine the problem. Jewelled bearings, like inside the indicator, might work. But I also have this idea in my head about using a thin sheet of spring steel as a fulcrum instead of a bearing. This way, the only hysteresis should come from the indicator itself. They do this sort of thing for micromanipulators to move small distances under a microscope.
Click to expand...

that is essentially how the Gordy setup works. and incidentally, it's working well now, with appropriate bushes. Kiff's been getting me my stuff in like two days..... other day I ordered 3 recoil lugs and 4 die blanks at 4:15PM and they were setting on my counter when I came home from work next day.....
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top