Ackley Questions

A

Any22

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Im having a little situation w/my 223 Ai Im not getting the life from my brass I feel I should ( 3/4 reloadings) with remington or winchester , I checked My expasion on the neck as this is where all of the failures occur. Not turning the necks . The dif between a neck sized ctg. And a fired ctg. is .008. Is this about right or am I working the necks too much? What brand of brass do most of you ackley shooters use ? The Rifle is a 700 Rem. W a Shillen Select Match , Varmint Profile Set up by a friend of Mine. Shoots Very well When I do my Part .0000000000001 a 1/2 mile;) but would like my brass to last longer. Load is 28.5 gr. h335 behind most any 50 gr. pill yes a 1/14 twist , Yes im old school dont shoot 500 gr. boooolits in a 223.
 
Hi Any22, in my opinion, Yes you are over working your case necks !! .008 is alot of working.. You should consider annealing to get longer life (up to 10 times more life) Or even try Lake City brass because it is my experience that they are much thicker then winchester and remington. Dan
 
Thanks Dan Ive been considering A move to military brass Dont know that I have any LC but certainly what I have is thicker than commercial brass. Im also considering a redding bushing Die . What Id like to know is what is a reasonable Amount to size cases too Seems As I read That .002 was about what you want to reduce them?Oh By the way Thats a 10 shot ag. on those accuracy stats. :rolleyes:
 
Also... what sort of sizing die are you using? If press- mounted with an expander button, standard Redding / RCBS / whatever type, it may be that your die is sizing the necks way undersize before they're pulled back over the button. I've seen as much as .006 to .008 undersize with some dies. This will overwork the necks as well as cause case stretching. Run a piece of brass in with the expander removed and measure. It may surprise you.

If using Wilson type neck sizer that does not expand the brass.... oops, back to square one.. :)
 
dies

Right now Im using a Lee Collett Die for std, 223 Works very well Seating With a Redding 223AI seating Die Or A 222 Match Rcbs Die either Does a good Job the Redding is a little less trouble & Does about as good a Job.
 
I'd be interested in the difference in neck size between fired and loaded rds.

The Lee or a bushing die should work the brass as little as possible.
I agree with others. Better brass and annealing.
 
It also might be a good idea to anneal Rem or Win brass right out of the bag before fireforming to AI.
All brass is annealed at the factory but maybe the lesser brands not so well.


longshooter
Its been a long time since I've used a Lee die and that was only one in 308 Win.
Most folks claim (I think) that the Lee die is limited in neck tension by the mandrel size. I did not find that to be the case with mine. I could adjust mine for varying neck tensions depending on how far I screwed it down.
Its actually the reason I stopped using the Lee because I felt I was getting inconsistent neck tensions due to the rubber stop collar.
Quite possible I had the die set up wrong back then.
Quite possible there were other contributing factors.
I was very green back then as opposed to a mottled green tint now.
 
Havent tried adjusting the die , good idea & didnt have the sense to check a loaded rnd So gonna do that also Keep those Ideas Commin . Thanks.
 
223ai

My 223AI is based on, of course, a Savage.

I use IMI brass.
H4198 Powder.
Rem 7 1/2 primers.
40 Grain VMax bullets
I run it at 4100 fps.

I continue to reload the same brass over and over. I have never had to toss any brass.

I use a Redding Type S neck die.
I use a Redding seater die (nothing fancy).
I have a Redding full length die, that I have yet to use.
I never use an expander ball.
The bushing in the neck die is .002" smaller than the loaded brass is.
 
I agree with Tony. Good brass should last more than 3-4 firings even with that much neck sizing. Without regard for how many times the brass has been fired, is the brass old? Try some new brass and get a bushing die. Just my two cents:)---Mike
 
I checked My expasion on the neck as this is where all of the failures occur.
Click to expand...

When you say failures, do you mean the necks are splitting or separation at the shoulder?

Are you seeing any signs of pressure such as loose primer pockets or heavy bolt lift?

Tony
 
Necks are splitting/ cracking horizontallabout mid way in the neck , I dont feel I have a headspace prob. looks like workhardened brass. I went to the lee collet die adj. site then tried it out on the die I was able to reduce the amount of neck reduction to 2/3 thou. & get satisfactory bullet tension I was sizing some std 223 Lc brass to fire form . I think this will be very intresting. Thanks Tony C.
 
I disagree with the pressumtion that brass is expected to last longer. Ive seen new shortmag brass split on one firing. And we all know how thick the necks are on those.
 
Dantiff

There is an interesting article in PO Ackley's book by Fred Huntington on Case Life. One test was with Winchester and Remington 30-06 brass. According to the article, two Winchester cases lasted 55 and 50 times being fired and full-length resized. Two Remington cases lasted 52 and 36 times. The rifle was a Model 70 Winchester using 150 grain Speer bullets at pressures higher than factory loads. :eek:

For safety reasons, obsiously, I'm not saying that cases should be reloaded and fired 50 times - or 10 times for that matter. Too many variables. I've never seen brass split on the first firing in a .223, 22BR, 30BR, 30 Major, 6PPC, .270, .222, 30-30, 30-06, .308 and others. Some of my Lapua PPC brass has been shot and reloaded more times that I care to admit, and it has thinner necks than the other calibers. :)



I have no experience with short mags, so I cannot comment on why the brass would split on the first firing - but I would not be too comfortable with any rifle/caliber/ammo combination that exhibits that behavior. :confused:

Tony Carpenter
 
Tony C, I have witnessed a winchester in a 223 wssm split the neck on factory ammo, almost every shot.... I know of a fellow shooting a 300 wsm getting 2 loads out of brass before necks split with a conservative load, shooting a remington.

With properly annealed brass and tight chamber specs one can expect moderate to exceptional brass life...
 
I shoot a 223AI alot. use redding FL dies and lapua brass. and .008 is way too much sizing. I have never had a problem with this combo.
 
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