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View Full Version : Opinions on ER collets please.



Pete Wass
12-20-2016, 04:08 PM
I bought a lathe last fall that came without any collet system. I am considering an ER collet system for it, one that I can use on both ends of the lathe and in my mill. I am thinking the ER collets are a better set-up for this scenario. To that end, I have decided on ER 40 collets, thinking they have the greatest versatility. Is my thinking sound on this?

Thanks,

Pete

Butch Lambert
12-20-2016, 04:23 PM
I know a very good gunsmith that loves them. Rod Henrickson in Canada.

Pete Wass
12-20-2016, 06:09 PM
I know a very good gunsmith that loves them. Rod Henrickson in Canada.

I appreciate your reply.

Pete

ranch23
12-20-2016, 07:28 PM
I have looked at them because I see them being used by Rod in multiple posts.

jackie schmidt
12-20-2016, 08:20 PM
We have three smaller mills in our Shop that we have converted to this system.

No complaints.

Pete Wass
12-20-2016, 08:56 PM
Guess I'll start looking.

Merry Christmas,

Pete

JerrySharrett
12-21-2016, 06:51 AM
ER collets (Erickson) style double taper collets have been used by the manufacturing industry for decades. The best holding and truest running collets available. Remember though, the Erickson style collets come in several size ranges, so when you convert to or reorder and you want, as example, a 1" capacity collet, it can come in different size ranges on the OD.

.

GeneT
12-21-2016, 07:43 AM
I made the switch to ER 40's in the shop about a year ago - headstock, tailstock, mill, and a floating chuck for mounting round work to the mill table, rotab, etc. I've been meaning to make a set of 'collet blocks' - like the 5C version, but for ER40. It's been great - best collet solution I've ever used.

GsT

Rubicon Prec.
12-21-2016, 08:29 AM
16C for the lathe spindle and ER20 and ER32 holders for the lathe and mill tools.

MilGunsmith
12-21-2016, 09:41 AM
I use ER-40 in a shopmade collet holder on my Southbend 9A and a shopmade ER-20 adapter for my Bridgeport M heads. It was easier to make the holder than to find B&S #7 collets, etc for the M head. Buy the collets as a set, buy the holding ring and make the adapter. I had to make the adapter on lathe at work because of the metric thread, but turned the collet seat at home on the lathe its used on. The M head adapters were both made complete on work lathe, I made the collet end first and then used the 1/2" collet to clamp it to a ground arbor and then did the taper.

Pete Wass
12-21-2016, 04:56 PM
a 1994 ENCO 12X36. It's' in great shape but has been banged around a bit from handling. It came on a heavy rickety wooden bench but I found a new and original cabinet on line for a good price and have been picking away repairing the banged up stuff. The 4 jaw chuck had never been mounted. Ways are blemish free and there are still scraping marks on the undersides of every surface I have uncovered, such as the scraping is :). Having been employed in that trade some yeas ago, I know how it should be.

It has one minor flaw, which I am trying to fix. The reversing relay sticks on and over-rides the emergency switch so it NEEDS to be fixed. I thread in reverse so I want it to work properly.

I also will add a 2 axis DRO to it when I get back home. Keith Fenner is doing one pretty much like mine in a YouTube series right now so that gives me some great reference to work with. Keith was fortunate to have a friend volunteer to scrape in his Saddle and slides for him, lucky dude that he is.

Nez sent me a whole relay set up but unfortunately, everything is 90* out from my wiring. I guess I could extend the wires but that is a bit messy so I will try to find a relay to replace the defective one in my box. A close friend here is a retired Honeywell technician so I am hopeful he will be able to find a suitable replacement. I am also considering simply adding a DC motor and controller of it and forget the AC stuff all together. I think I would go up in HP vs the AC 1.5HP motor on the machine if I do that.

So comes the Collet situation. I plan to start ordering the collets and chucks I will need for the lathe and mill right away. I will buy the cam lock setup for the spindle, a Morse #3 for the tailstock and an R8 for my mill. That should do me very well. I am thinking the full 23 pc set by 1/8"ths and the chucks separate. I read that one can find the ER 40 Collet Blocks from a supplier in Australia, I believe it is. Would like to find the name of the company if any one knows it.

SO, lots of fun. I think the machine I have will be far and away above the 10L I will be replacing, once I have finished up these items. I was able to use the aft Spider off my 10L to locate spider screws into the rear of the spindle on the new machine and that worked out very well. I simply used the spider to drill and tap through. Easy Peasy.

Merry Happy,

Pete

Matt P
12-22-2016, 01:12 AM
http://www.ausee.com.au/shop/category.aspx?catid=11

Is that what your after ??
Matt P

gstprecision
12-22-2016, 07:27 AM
I have a few set or ER20 and 32 that I use in the tail stock. I got them from Asian suppliers and they are all good so far.

I am still looking for a D1-4 ER collet chuck but haven't found anything, maybe haven't searched hard enough. I could get a backplate and a ER chuck, but would rather a complete assembly. If you find a d1-4 I would be interested to know your supplier.

GST

Pete Wass
12-22-2016, 11:54 AM
I have a few set or ER20 and 32 that I use in the tail stock. I got them from Asian suppliers and they are all good so far.

I am still looking for a D1-4 ER collet chuck but haven't found anything, maybe haven't searched hard enough. I could get a backplate and a ER chuck, but would rather a complete assembly. If you find a d1-4 I would be interested to know your supplier.

GST

There is one listed there for just under a hundred dollars.

Pete

Pete Wass
12-22-2016, 11:55 AM
http://www.ausee.com.au/shop/category.aspx?catid=11

Is that what your after ??
Matt P

Good looking stuff :).

Thanks,

Pete

Pete Wass
12-22-2016, 12:01 PM
http://www.ausee.com.au/shop/category.aspx?catid=11

Is that what your after ??
Matt P

Tis what I am looking for all be them a bit pricey but at least someone makes them, eh?

Merry Christmas,

Pete

Pete Wass
12-22-2016, 12:07 PM
I use ER-40 in a shopmade collet holder on my Southbend 9A and a shopmade ER-20 adapter for my Bridgeport M heads. It was easier to make the holder than to find B&S #7 collets, etc for the M head. Buy the collets as a set, buy the holding ring and make the adapter. I had to make the adapter on lathe at work because of the metric thread, but turned the collet seat at home on the lathe its used on. The M head adapters were both made complete on work lathe, I made the collet end first and then used the 1/2" collet to clamp it to a ground arbor and then did the taper.

to make holders myself. I have never been very good at using machines even though I love using them. I have always been pretty good at using "Spanners" but the things that require fine attention to details; not so much. Now that I am into my 7 th decade, well, I don't hold out a lot of hope that somehow I will get a lot better at very much.

Merry Christmas,

Pete

WSnyder
12-22-2016, 12:53 PM
http://www.littlemachineshop.com/products/product_category.php?category=-421559299

Pete Wass
12-22-2016, 01:07 PM
http://www.littlemachineshop.com/products/product_category.php?category=-421559299

the ER collet blocks are coming down in price. unfortunately there are no ER 40's listed there :(

Pete

gstprecision
12-23-2016, 08:38 AM
Thanks Pete,

After searching a bit more I found this: http://www.hhip.com/machine-tool-accessories/chucks-er-collet/er-fixtures/collet-chuck-for-er-40-125mm-diameter-d1-4-3901-5042.html

Cheers
GST

Butch Lambert
12-23-2016, 10:05 AM
the ER collet blocks are coming down in price. unfortunately there are no ER 40's listed there :(

Pete

Pete, I'll call my Uncle Bill in a couple hours and see what he has. Bill has a tremendous amount of tooling that he needs to get rid of.

Pete Wass
12-23-2016, 02:53 PM
Thanks Pete,

After searching a bit more I found this: http://www.hhip.com/machine-tool-accessories/chucks-er-collet/er-fixtures/collet-chuck-for-er-40-125mm-diameter-d1-4-3901-5042.html

Cheers
GST

That looks like the one all right.

Pete

Pete Wass
12-23-2016, 02:54 PM
Pete, I'll call my Uncle Bill in a couple hours and see what he has. Bill has a tremendous amount of tooling that he needs to get rid of.

Pete

RJM
12-25-2016, 02:14 PM
the ER collet blocks are coming down in price. unfortunately there are no ER 40's listed there :(

Pete

Yes there are

https://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=5452&category=-421559299
https://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=5666&category=-421559299

Regards,
Ron

Ian_Owen
12-25-2016, 06:49 PM
Pete, 100mm ER40 collet chuck to mount on a backplate is available on Ebay
http://www.ebay.com/itm/100MM-DIAMETER-ER-40-COLLET-CHUCK-3901-5036-/231958374996?hash=item3601cbea54%3Ag%3A0U0AAOSwint XSJFI

While the ER40 collet blocks are available ex UK
http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue/Collets/ER-Collet-Fixtures/Stevensons-ER40-Collet-Blocks

Ian

Pete Wass
12-26-2016, 12:13 PM
Pete, 100mm ER40 collet chuck to mount on a backplate is available on Ebay
http://www.ebay.com/itm/100MM-DIAMETER-ER-40-COLLET-CHUCK-3901-5036-/231958374996?hash=item3601cbea54%3Ag%3A0U0AAOSwint XSJFI

While the ER40 collet blocks are available ex UK
http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue/Collets/ER-Collet-Fixtures/Stevensons-ER40-Collet-Blocks

Ian

I will look into these.

Happy New Year,

Pete

Pete Wass
12-26-2016, 12:15 PM
Yes there are

https://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=5452&category=-421559299
https://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=5666&category=-421559299

Regards,
Ron

I didn't look deep enough, did I? Bought my first mill from them. Nice little machine.

Happy New Year,

Pete

Pete Wass
01-13-2017, 02:44 PM
I sent for and have received a D1 4 ER 40 collet holder. It is machined and fit excellently and was about a hundred bucks. It appears to be a good start. Next comes the collet kit. I plan to buy an R8 kit for my mill with about 20 collets. After that, if those look good I will get a M3 holder and I should be set.



Pete

NezRongero
01-13-2017, 02:48 PM
I sent for and have received a D1 4 ER 40 collet holder. It is machined and fit excellently and was about a hundred bucks. It appears to be a good start. Next comes the collet kit. I plan to buy an R8 kit for my mill with about 20 collets. After that, if those look good I will get a M3 holder and I should be set.



Pete

Pete,

Could share with us the precision and accuracy testing of the collet chuck when you have the chance to do it?


nez

Pete Wass
01-13-2017, 02:55 PM
Pete,

Could share with us the precision and accuracy testing of the collet chuck when you have the chance to do it?


nez

When I get back home in April :( .

Pete

TRA
01-13-2017, 10:33 PM
Pete,

Could share with us the precision and accuracy testing of the collet chuck when you have the chance to do it?


nez

I'm not Pete, but ER's are about as good as they get. You can expect around .0002 or better with quality collets and holders. Don't bank on that with chicom brands. As with everything in the machine world, you get what you pay for. We use ER collets in place of drill chucks, except for drill press work in our Bridgeport's. A Cat 40 ER tool holder is cheaper than a Cat 40 arbor and a super chuck and they don't ruin your tooling shanks. It's a sad day when a quality drill chuck is no longer made in the USA. ER collets are also rather forgiving with over and under sized tooling.

TG collets are good also but pricey and bulky. those we use to drive taps in our machining centers.

R8 collets- You will find you will only use 6 or so of the sizes and the rest just hang in the rack, "IF" you use a drill chuck. Most guys do. If you are going to use drills in your collets "Never" use them in a chuck. That especially goes for reamers.

ER 40 collets and holders are rather bulky???

Keep in mind that when you see tooling prices coming down.......BEWARE. There's a reason and you'll find the prices and quality are racing each other to the bottom. Actually that's consistent with anything we purchase in the US.

Pete Wass
01-13-2017, 11:33 PM
I have been thinking about going for a smaller ER setup for the mill because of the size of the ER 40's. My mill is small all around so I would never use large hole sizes in it anyway, I don't think. So, perhaps I will focus on a Morse taper #3 for now with the ER 40Collets and deal with my mill later. I have end mill holders for it along with a basic R8 collet set soooooo. I don't expect ultra low runout with these tools. I am only a hobbyist and don't demand ultra precision. If they are within .0005" I will be satisfied.

Thanks for the input.

Pere

TRA
01-14-2017, 01:56 AM
I have been thinking about going for a smaller ER setup for the mill because of the size of the ER 40's. My mill is small all around so I would never use large hole sizes in it anyway, I don't think. So, perhaps I will focus on a Morse taper #3 for now with the ER 40Collets and deal with my mill later. I have end mill holders for it along with a basic R8 collet set soooooo. I don't expect ultra low runout with these tools. I am only a hobbyist and don't demand ultra precision. If they are within .0005" I will be satisfied.

Thanks for the input.

Pere

Why not just use R8's ? The less adapters the better. The only collets we use in our bridgeport's are R8's. End mills drills reamers, center drills.....all R8.

Pete Wass
01-14-2017, 04:27 PM
Why not just use R8's ? The less adapters the better. The only collets we use in our bridgeport's are R8's. End mills drills reamers, center drills.....all R8.

having end mills slip in R-8,s, why the end mill holders. From what I've read, the ER series have a stronger purchase and have a larger range. Heck, R8's would probably do me I guess. I do have a bunch of very small end mills that I may or may not ever use but one always want's to be prepared, eh?

Pete