PDA

View Full Version : Swiss Tool Posts



Jay Cutright
10-17-2016, 01:32 AM
I bought an old Southbend 10L last year and this tool post and tool holders came with it.
This is Chinese stuff, but it doesn't look exactly like Create tools does anyone recognize these parts?
I'm thinking about putting them on my gearhead Southbend and test drive them a while and would like to know what they are for sure.

GeneT
10-17-2016, 07:45 AM
Generically it's just called a "40-position" tool holder. Should work fine. Only downside to them is the holders are harder to find and more expensive than Dorian / Aloris styles.

GsT

CMaier
10-17-2016, 10:55 AM
Most of that quick change tooling works great for job shop work, but seldom are used where accuracy and high volume is absolutely necessary.

?????????????????????????

aloris and dorian are not high quality , do not produce high quality parts ??

Jay Cutright
10-17-2016, 12:13 PM
I'm still not sure of the brand name but I think I found the source for the version I have at hh machine. Found some on eBay that come from the same place.
If I can get the center stem that I need to fit this to my lathe I'll buy a couple more tool holders and use this for a while just to see how I like it.

CMaier
10-17-2016, 01:41 PM
cannot make/adapt a plate to fit your lathe and use the current bolt ?

Jay Cutright
10-17-2016, 02:46 PM
cannot make/adapt a plate to fit your lathe and use the current bolt ?

I can make the plate that fits the T slot. The center bolt that was in use on the 10L isn't in any way the correct piece, not for the Taiwanese Southbend lathe or the 10L.

I'll post a pic of it when I can.

brickeyee
10-17-2016, 08:08 PM
Most of that quick change tooling works great for job shop work, but seldom are used where accuracy and high volume is absolutely necessary.


Who would bother with a quick change Aloris on a production lathe?

A plain old rocker set up for a specific job is far less expensive.

CMaier
10-17-2016, 08:58 PM
who would bother with the multiple setups with a rocker when you have repeatable single setups with a quality qc ?
you have me confused


Who would bother with a quick change Aloris on a production lathe?

A plain old rocker set up for a specific job is far less expensive.

Jdh
10-17-2016, 11:00 PM
It is a copy of a Swiss Multifix 40 position tool post. They are strong and very repeatable. The holders are expensive even the Chicom copies. The German and Swiss originals are very expensive.

The center post can be changed out to whatever you want. Just use a bolt or CRS rod that fits the tool post. Make a T-nut for the compound and thread it . Locktite a rod that is threaded on both ends to the T-nut and use a flange nut on top. You may or may not have to make a washer to build up the tool post so you can adjust the holders for the size tools you use.

The tool post is locked down on the compound and the holders can be released and indexed in 9* increments and relocked without unlocking the tool post. The originals were pinned to the compound. You do not have to do that. It is a very strong set up just bolted down.

You can make a slotted rectangle bar the length and height of the slot in the tool holder and slot it for 1/4" and use that size HSS tool bits. Make it wide enough to allow the locking screws to be on the outside. Just drill and tap a series of machine screws on top to lock the tool bit down. That will enable you to get greater reach to get better clearance on certain set ups. That is one thing the rocker is very good for. It allows getting into tight places. You can do the same thing with the tool adapter.

You also can use small rocker tool holders clamped in the tool post if they will fit. That adds to the versatility of it.

Joe

Jay Cutright
10-18-2016, 11:05 AM
It is a copy of a Swiss Multifix 40 position tool post. They are strong and very repeatable. The holders are expensive even the Chicom copies. The German and Swiss originals are very expensive.

The center post can be changed out to whatever you want. Just use a bolt or CRS rod that fits the tool post. Make a T-nut for the compound and thread it . Locktite a rod that is threaded on both ends to the T-nut and use a flange nut on top. You may or may not have to make a washer to build up the tool post so you can adjust the holders for the size tools you use.

The tool post is locked down on the compound and the holders can be released and indexed in 9* increments and relocked without unlocking the tool post. The originals were pinned to the compound. You do not have to do that. It is a very strong set up just bolted down.

You can make a slotted rectangle bar the length and height of the slot in the tool holder and slot it for 1/4" and use that size HSS tool bits. Make it wide enough to allow the locking screws to be on the outside. Just drill and tap a series of machine screws on top to lock the tool bit down. That will enable you to get greater reach to get better clearance on certain set ups. That is one thing the rocker is very good for. It allows getting into tight places. You can do the same thing with the tool adapter.

You also can use small rocker tool holders clamped in the tool post if they will fit. That adds to the versatility of it.

Joe

Thanks Joe but you in know way helped me out. Lol! With all your efforts to type all that out all I really asked for is a company name... can you identify this part?
I can appreciate someone who is willing to help but all I asked was for someone to identify what company or business sells this tool post. I need the center bolt that goes right up the middle of the tool post to be able to use this thing.
I don't take time from my other machines to make parts that are mass produced in china. I would spend more time making that part than it would take to earn $250 on one of my other lathes. Create tools sells an almost exact copy of the tool post I have for $250 and it comes with 4 tool holders.

Jay Cutright
10-18-2016, 11:08 AM
Who would bother with a quick change Aloris on a production lathe?

A plain old rocker set up for a specific job is far less expensive.

If I had to use the rocker tool post I would quit doing machine work!😖

Jay Cutright
10-18-2016, 11:11 AM
I'm pretty sure I found a source for this stuff at H&H Machine, I'm busy in the shop and haven't had time to contact them to purchase the center bolt that I need and a few more tool holders.

CMaier
10-18-2016, 12:38 PM
i can use a rocker but do not know why a person would.

If I had to use the rocker tool post I would quit doing machine work!😖

brickeyee
10-18-2016, 02:19 PM
i can use a rocker but do not know why a person would.

We used them on a machine that churned out identical parts day in and day out.

That lathe had a huge mechanical system for movement.

It ran barely attended making specialized break off head screws.

Jay Cutright
10-18-2016, 04:11 PM
cannot make/adapt a plate to fit your lathe and use the current bolt ?

Here's a pic of it. The bolt is about a half inch to short, all I need to make it work is another half inch of thread.

Louis.J
10-18-2016, 05:13 PM
SHARS sells the import copy as well as the tool holders. You might check with them on the part you are in need of.

JLouis

Jay Cutright
10-18-2016, 05:54 PM
Thanks, Louis
I found Shars earlier today in a link on eBay but I didn't take the time to see what all they had. I was surprised to find a big machine and tool retailer in Illinois that I hadn't heard of yet.
I will look into the parts I need there if H&H Machine doesn't come through for me.

jackie schmidt
10-18-2016, 09:47 PM
We are a Job Shop, specializing in Marine Repair. We are involved in the manufacture and repair of little bitty parts, and very large parts.

We have Aloris Tool Holders on ever Lathe in the shop, from the smallest, to the largest.

The reason we use these type holders is simple. We are interested in maximizing our profits by furnishing our employs with the best tooling available.

Jay Cutright
10-18-2016, 10:09 PM
👍👍👍

CMaier
10-18-2016, 11:15 PM
and here i thought i was going crazy.
thanks jackie

i think some people are stuck in the 19th century.
( yes i know we are way past that but some are not)

TRA
10-19-2016, 03:24 AM
and here i thought i was going crazy.
thanks jackie

i think some people are stuck in the 19th century.
( yes i know we are way past that but some are not)

Stuck in the 19 century would be using drill bits held into tailstock sporting a ky chuck. The tailstock is the must unstable and constantly runs out any time you move or crank the spindle in or out

I don't own a chip maker that is not Cnc and has a automatic tool changer. The higher level gun builders are doing the same thing.

CMaier
10-19-2016, 10:32 AM
maybe thinking it was a finished hole instead of BORING to the finished size would be 19th century.
strange you saw the need to pull your "Most of that quick change tooling works great for job shop work, but seldom are used where accuracy and high volume is absolutely necessary. " post.


Stuck in the 19 century would be using drill bits held into tailstock sporting a ky chuck. The tailstock is the must unstable and constantly runs out any time you move or crank the spindle in or out

I don't own a chip maker that is not Cnc and has a automatic tool changer. The higher level gun builders are doing the same thing.

TRA
10-19-2016, 02:46 PM
maybe thinking it was a finished hole instead of BORING to the finished size would be 19th century.
strange you saw the need to pull your "Most of that quick change tooling works great for job shop work, but seldom are used where accuracy and high volume is absolutely necessary. " post.
No, I understood the process of drilling and boring perfectly. I pulled it because we are conversing at different wavelengths.

As far as QC tool holders, I actually like the Aloris brand, but I also understand their limitations. Every time you change a tool it's ability to hold zero is compromised. They also contribute to stability issues. They are good at doing what they were designed for. The misconception about this particular tool holder is in calling it a Swiss tool post. That's a moniker placed on it by the manufacturer, and they should not be confused with "Swiss Tooling"