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View Full Version : OK, so I found a Heavy 10



alinwa
05-14-2016, 03:47 PM
I'm going to try a Heavy 10 lathe to compare with my junky Grizzly......find out if the hype is all that.

QUESTION; The one I've located is in good shape but is 120V, single-phase power. Is this normal?

Do I need to wait and find a 3-phase or even 240 machine???

tx
Al

Rflshootr
05-14-2016, 05:18 PM
Al,
I've seen them in both configurations. I don't think in any barreling operation, that you'd be able to pull enough horsepower so slow it down with a good belt on the machine. I've done quite a bit of work on a 9" South Bend that only uses a 1" flat belt and even that is pretty strong. The motor won't be a problem IMO.

Butch Lambert
05-14-2016, 06:36 PM
Al, does it have the D1 type chuck setup. I think a 3ph motor will give a finer finish. Right size 120V will be OK.

JerrySharrett
05-14-2016, 06:55 PM
I'm going to try a Heavy 10 lathe to compare with my junky Grizzly......find out if the hype is all that.

QUESTION; The one I've located is in good shape but is 120V, single-phase power. Is this normal?

Do I need to wait and find a 3-phase or even 240 machine???

tx
Al

It's not the phase or the voltage that propels the spindle, it's the horsepower. There are on- line calculators to determine HP based on the depth of cut, federate, and material being machined.

.

alinwa
05-14-2016, 07:20 PM
I don't care about power.... I care about finish. I don't want phase chatter....

If this one will cut shiney threads that's all I care about.

Dude says it has a "D4.4" 4-jaw. It comes with a 3-jaw and a 4-jaw and the chucks are threaded onto the spindle, 1 3/8 bore.

http://eugene.craigslist.org/tls/5554291172.html

Jay Cutright
05-15-2016, 03:06 AM
Al, if the ways are in good condition you should've already bought that machine.
The "input shaft" on that single tumbler gear box will turn half the speed of the newer 10L's with the wide range gearbox and make half as much noise too.
Take a look on eBay and see if you can find a 1hp 3ph motor and drum switch to convert it if you want go that route. That could also make another experiment to see if 3ph really is better.;)
That looks like a set of metric change gears in the picture. I was given a brand new set of metric change gears so I changed my machine over to 3ph to have the instant reverse function useful for cutting metric threads. I'm planning to drill and tap the chuck and use a set screw to help prevent the chuck from popping loose in a instant reverse moment.
The threaded spindles are about 1" narrower than the camlock.

That stand looks like it's in excellent condition. I've been shopping Southbend lathes a lot for the past 6 months and I don't remember seeing one of those stands with drawers under the middle of it that was still in good condition.
If I were at a match in Washington and saw that add while was there I'd be renting a uhaul trailer and bringing that lathe home with me.

alinwa
05-15-2016, 07:42 PM
Al, if the ways are in good condition you should've already bought that machine.
The lead screw on that single tumbler gear box will turn half the speed of the newer 10L's with the wide range gearbox and make half as much noise too.
Take a look on eBay and see if you can find a 1hp 3ph motor and drum switch to convert it if you want go that route. That could also make another experiment to see if 3ph really is better.;)
That looks like a set of metric change gears in the picture. I was given a brand new set of metric change gears so I changed my machine over to 3ph to have the instant reverse function useful for cutting metric threads. I'm planning to drill and tap the chuck and use a set screw to help prevent the chuck from popping loose in a instant reverse moment.
The threaded spindles are about 1" narrower than the camlock.

That stand looks like it's in excellent condition. I've been shopping Southbend lathes a lot for the past 6 months and I don't remember seeing one of those stands with drawers under the middle of it that was still in good condition.
If I were at a match in Washington and saw that add while was there I'd be renting a uhaul trailer and bringing that lathe home with me.
Headed back north on I-5.

Got it with me

alinwa
05-16-2016, 12:51 PM
Headed back north on I-5.

Got it with me

Didn't want to send this from the road, but yup......this is how WE do it out here in cawffee country

Truckload of concentrate.......


17795

Zebra13
05-16-2016, 01:42 PM
Al,

Every able-bodied male should own a couple of lathes...

If you decide to start tearing stuff apart, I highly recommend "A Guide to Renovating the South Bend Lathe" and the rebuild kit available on Ebay. The book is very well done. With the book, my dumb ass had no problem tearing apart the slides and carriage, replacing the wicks and felts, and getting it all back together again. I'm going into the headstock next.

There is also a gent on Ebay who sells the recommended lubricants for the Heavy 10 in smaller quantities. If I had it to do all over again, I would have gone that route as opposed to buying the fluids in bulk.

It sounds like you have the threaded spindle. The D1-4 spindle is desirable, but for the chambering process, I think the threaded spindle is just fine. I have seen D1-4 spindles on Ebay, if you have to have one. If you do change spindles, I don't know if you would have to put new bearings in the headstock...I'm sure Sharrett or one of the other fellas will know.

For a small machine, it's a heavy little bugger, isn't it?!

Justin

Butch Lambert
05-16-2016, 05:24 PM
I believe the H10 has bronze bushings, not bearings. I do prefer the D1-4 setup.

alinwa
05-16-2016, 08:45 PM
Al, if the ways are in good condition you should've already bought that machine.
The lead screw on that single tumbler gear box will turn half the speed of the newer 10L's with the wide range gearbox and make half as much noise too.
Take a look on eBay and see if you can find a 1hp 3ph motor and drum switch to convert it if you want go that route. That could also make another experiment to see if 3ph really is better.;)
That looks like a set of metric change gears in the picture. I was given a brand new set of metric change gears so I changed my machine over to 3ph to have the instant reverse function useful for cutting metric threads. I'm planning to drill and tap the chuck and use a set screw to help prevent the chuck from popping loose in a instant reverse moment.
The threaded spindles are about 1" narrower than the camlock.

That stand looks like it's in excellent condition. I've been shopping Southbend lathes a lot for the past 6 months and I don't remember seeing one of those stands with drawers under the middle of it that was still in good condition.
If I were at a match in Washington and saw that add while was there I'd be renting a uhaul trailer and bringing that lathe home with me.

The threaded spindles are about 1" narrower than the camlock.


What do you mean here Jay? That the spindle bore is smaller on this one than on the new ones? Or do you mean length, like can do shorter barrels?

I'm a little concerned with the threaded shaft since I do cut inside-out quite a bit, I'll have to think about changing it out unless I can key/setscrew/pin it somehow.

Maybe Jerry'll help me with how big a deal it is to change to D1-4

In any case...... I'M EXCITED :) .......I've had my ear to the ground for quite some time, especially since mikeinco sent me a collet closer a couple yrs back, and out here in The Left they're not exactly thick on the ground. I'm happy to have it, period. Even if I only use it as a collet mo'chine I'm happy happy happy....plus I've got about 15 pool cue shafts waiting for that taper attachment/milling head. I can clamp a small router in there I hope.....and don't expect to lose money on it in the long run which is cool. That's like a free machine to me! And I really did buy it for the collet feature, for making dies.

And then Jay made my day with the slow speed thing....

And it is QUIET compared to the Grizzly.....which BTW will still going to be my go-to for hogging, carbide and chambering work. I din't mean it when I called it junkie ;)

Thanks guys for all your help

did I mention I'm excited??

lol
al

Jay Cutright
05-16-2016, 10:48 PM
Al, I just happen to have a camlock spindle and bearings in a box here at the house, it measures 13" through the spindle to the back side of the chuck. The threaded spindle on the 10L I have in storage is as I remember 12" to the back side of the chuck back plate. This is what I meant by narrower.
I'm all the time running into a situation where I'm thinking "my head stock is to wide". I'm always modifying chucks and reworking spiders and now buying smaller machines with internally ground spindles to facilitate doing precision machining on shorter barrels.
The 10L, the little Emco maximat and the new Taiwanese heavy ten are about the narrowest lathes I've found so I bought some of them.

Jay Cutright
05-16-2016, 10:57 PM
Here's a pic of it.

Jay Cutright
05-17-2016, 12:38 AM
That book zebra13 wrote about is a good book. I read through that book before I tore my machine down for new gaskets and wicks.
I haven't worked on the 10L in a few months but I'm getting close to being done with it.
I'm anxious to see how much better it machines threads for me but the 2" travel tail stock is something I'm not looking forward to using.

Tim Singleton
05-17-2016, 08:32 AM
That book zebra13 wrote about is a good book. I read through that book before I tore my machine down for new gaskets and wicks.
I haven't worked on the 10L in a few months but I'm getting close to being done with it.
I'm anxious to see how much better it machines threads for me but the 2" travel tail stock is something I'm not looking forward to using.
How do I find a copy of this book?

Jay Cutright
05-17-2016, 10:25 AM
Look at this on eBay http://www.ebay.com/itm/160588106078

Zebra13
05-17-2016, 11:29 AM
I believe the H10 has bronze bushings, not bearings. I do prefer the D1-4 setup.

"Bushings, bearings, bushings, bearings, let's call the whole thing off". I'm showing my age right there...and if you get the reference, so are you.

Butch,

You are correct...they are bronze, but South Bend calls them "spindle sleeve bearings".

All,

In the picture of the D1-4 camlock spindle posted by Jay, they are the gold/bronze colored things behind the camlock, and at the opposite side of the spindle.

The D1-4 would certainly make chuck changes easier, and allow cutting with the lathe running in reverse, and per the lathes.uk website, it is stronger than the threaded spindle.

Given the mechanics of the spindle/bearing relationship, I don't know if one can swap spindles and still use the same bearings. I don't know if the bearings would wear different from spindle to spindle. I'll defer to the experts on that one.

Jay,

If you are looking to part ways with that D1-4 spindle, I'd be interested.

Justin

Jay Cutright
05-17-2016, 12:09 PM
I bought that camlock spindle to change my 10L to camlock. The inboard bearing and journal have quite a bit of wear but having the bearings that are worn with the spindle makes this a really great buy for the $75 I gave for it.
I'm hanging onto it for now.

My 10L is so low mileage that everything inside it looked like brand new so I opted to leave it as it was replacing only the wicks/felts and doing a lot of cleaning & painting.
I'm not sure I will get over the bug that causes some men to keep buying old machines, it definitely has bitten. I have over 12000 pounds of American made machinery waiting for me to clean up set in position and run wire to so I can use it. That spindle tells me there is another 10L in my future.

MilGunsmith
05-17-2016, 02:54 PM
I have been using belt driven lathes with a threaded spindle for over 40 years, never had a chuck come off yet. I currently own four South Bends, three 9A's and a 13" O. You can go to these web sights for info on your South Bend; http://www.wewilliams.net/SBLibrary.htm and http://www.wswells.com/. The Practical Machinist Forum Board also has a South Bend page.

Jay Cutright
05-18-2016, 09:16 PM
An old man once told me to cut a piece of thin cardboard or gasket material and place it on the spindle so the chuck tightens down against it.
I pictured making a washer out of the chipboard used on the back of a notebook when he told me about it.
He said that doing this would allow one to tighten the chuck as tight as needed to cut in reverse and do quick direction changes without running the risk of having the chuck jammed so tight on the spindle that it won't come off.
He said he learned this after seeing a couple of back-plates get machined of of the spindle when they gave up breaking the threaded joint loose.
Anyone else ever hear of such a thing?

Jay Cutright
01-02-2017, 02:57 PM
Hey Alinwa,
How are you getting along with the 10L? I just edited a couple glitches in my posts and tapped on the craigslist add you posted to take another look at your heavy ten, the add was gone.
You didn't give up and sell it did you?

jkl
01-02-2017, 03:05 PM
I used the wick and felt kit from Ebay it has everything you need. You can by T nuts for the cross slide and compound and you will take out much of the backlash.

John

Jay Cutright
01-02-2017, 03:46 PM
I used the wick and felt kit from Ebay it has everything you need. You can by T nuts for the cross slide and compound and you will take out much of the backlash.

John

I replaced the cross feed lead screw and nut on mine with a remanufactured part. There's some new old stock parts out there if you can find them but from what I saw the remanufactured part is top shelf, made in u.s.a. and sells for less so that's what is on my lathe.

alinwa
01-02-2017, 05:13 PM
Hey Alinwa,
How are you getting along with the 10L? I just edited a couple glitches in my posts and tapped on the craigslist add you posted to take another look at your heavy ten, the add was gone.
You didn't give up and sell it did you?

It's mine....it's up and running and it ain't for sale ;)

The handy-dandy collet closer setting in the drawer didn't work out but the manual collet system is fine. I've converted the toolpost to Aloris style and it runs very quietly. For my usage as a dedicated collet machine it's perfect.

Jay Cutright
01-02-2017, 05:23 PM
It's mine....it's up and running and it ain't for sale ;)

The handy-dandy collet closer setting in the drawer didn't work out but the manual collet system is fine. I've converted the toolpost to Aloris style and it runs very quietly. For my usage as a dedicated collet machine it's perfect.

Have you chambered/threaded a barrel with it?

alinwa
01-02-2017, 06:30 PM
Have you chambered/threaded a barrel with it?

Nope, I'm dedicating it to die-making as of now....sticking with the collet system.