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gabe ledesma
12-25-2012, 02:40 PM
In the last few years i have noticed that ther is more custom actions ordered with PPC 308 bolt combos. I am getting ready to get me one more custom action. Am i better off getting one that has a PPC bolt face only,or one that will work with a PPC and 308 bolt face?. My new gun will be a PPC. Do guns with PPC 308 bolts have more problems extracting a PPC case than one that has a PPC bolt only? the action that i will order will be RB-LP-RE. Gabe

abintx
12-25-2012, 07:42 PM
In the last few years i have noticed that there is more custom actions ordered with PPC 308 bolt combos. I am getting ready to get me one more custom action. Am i better off getting one that has a PPC bolt face only, or one that will work with a PPC and 308 bolt face?. My new gun will be a PPC. Do guns with PPC 308 bolts have more problems extracting a PPC case than one that has a PPC bolt only? the action that i will order will be RB-LP-RE. Gabe

Your question might best be relocated to the Gunsmiths Corner.

Having said that, I have two identical RB-LP-RE 7.5B B.A.T. actions, one used in my light varmint rifle chambered for the 6PPC. The other, used in my heavy varmint, chambered for the 30BR. I intend to have a light varmint Krieger barrel chambered in 30BR, for use in my light varmint rifle. I called B.A.T. to see if I could use the heavy varmint's 7.5B bolt in the light varmint's action and the answer was yes, since they were both manufactured within months of each other.

Each bolt in this situation will be doing single duty, extracting cases they were designed and manufactured for. Separate bolts for the same action. Screw the 6PPC barrel off, screw the 30BR barrel on, use the bolt for the 30BR. Screw the 30BR barrel off, replace it with the 6PPC barrel, return to the 6PPC bolt. It's another option you might want to consider depending on the cartridges being contemplated.

Charles E
12-25-2012, 08:06 PM
It depends on the specifics of the action. It can be as simple as no problem, to having two extractors which aren't that hard to change out.

I would contact the manufacturer and ask, mentioning the chamberings you are considering. For goodness sake, if you can't trust them on that, what could you trust them on?

However, I will say with my PPC-only bolts, I have no issues with a .30 PPC for point-blank score, or a case made on either the 6.5 Carcano or 6.5x54 M-S for long range. The first chambering I made on the 6.5x54 M-S was in fact too big, almost as much capacity as a .243 Winchester. Shot well, though.

Edit:

The "eject" may be an issue. I have an early BAT RB-LP-RE, dual (PPC/308) boltface. Everything is fine with both a PPC and .30BR, except the "eject" part. I believe Bruce has changed the design a lot from that early model, so that may not be a problem now. But for a longer case, like my "whatever x54 M-S," who knows?

Mike Bryant
12-26-2012, 08:20 AM
The longer cases usually aren't the problem when it comes to ejecting. With them, the case head stays on the extractor until the neck clears the ejection port even if it is ejecting into the lug area of the raceway. The location of the extractor is what makes it difficult to eject PPC cases. If the extractor lets the case eject into the lug area of the raceway instead of the round portion next to the lug, then frequently there is more trouble getting 100% ejection. Sliding plate extractors located in the lug have more trouble ejecting short cases as the extractor tends to lose it's grasp of the case head before it ejects. Add in an oversize bolt face as with the BR sized bolt face and trying to extract a PPC you'll also tend to have more trouble ejecting PPC's. Personally, I'd go with a PPC bolt face for a PPC and an extra bolt for a BR if you had only one action. However, by the time you buy an extra bolt, you aren't much off the cost of another complete action. That said, I had a Farley with ejector and BR bolt face that didn't give any problems ejecting PPC cases. If you have to worry about ejection when competing, you'd be about as well off not having the ejector. The ejector has to work 100% of the time without throwing the case off the bench if you're going to compete in 100/200 yard benchrest with an ejector. If you worry about the case rolling off the bench, then it takes away from your concentration besides having to look for brass after the group.

Lucky Shooter A
12-27-2012, 11:18 AM
I have a Stiller Viper SS action with the PPC/308 bolt face.

I've never had a failure to extract the Lapua 220 R cases but haven't used the action for any 308 head-size rounds. I like the idea of being able to move into a
30 BR with the same action.

Can't comment on any other actions but couldn't be happier with what I have.

A. Weldy

Charles E
12-27-2012, 09:17 PM
I have a Stiller Viper SS action with the PPC/308 bolt face.

Is this a drop-port Viper? I have one of the early Viper drop-ports (not stainless, the similar-to-Panda version).

As I said, mine's early, a batch 2, I believe, where there was still some taper in the action thread. This uses a Remington-type extractor, and will not pick up a .308 case.

A friend with a similar action had the "drop hole" & "lips" opened up, and then turned the rims of the BR cases for a most-of-the time solution. Still a problem now & then; he finally just got a second bolt.

With that in the back of my mind, I've just chambered up my drop-port for the .30 PPC -- another friend has one of those (on a 3-lug BAT), and has cleaned our clocks often enough for me to trust that chambering.

I'd ALWAYS consult the manufacturer, and take their recommendations pretty seriously.

Lucky Shooter A
12-28-2012, 11:14 AM
Charles,

This action is not a drop port----just a very good action without an ejector.

A. Weldy

stiller
12-29-2012, 01:07 AM
Without an ejector, the universal sliding plate works almost all the time. With an ejector, its very hit and miss for the smaller diameter cartridge. Even the dedicated face models can have issues ejecting the short cases like a ppc or br with the sliding plate extractor. The sako or mini-16 work much better for ejection. The drop port with the correct face always works, that the real beauty of it.

REMY
12-30-2012, 10:48 AM
Try asking Jim Borden

macflyboy
12-30-2012, 11:04 AM
Gabe,
If I were to order and new action it would be a Marsh, RB, LP, RE, they are small, light and strong.

MAC

David Halblom
12-30-2012, 07:14 PM
Gabe,
If I were to order and new action it would be a Marsh, RB, LP, RE, they are small, light and strong.

MAC

I applaud the fact that another person has gotten into the action building game. That being said, why would you by a Panda copy instead of a Panda?

David

macflyboy
12-30-2012, 09:58 PM
Shorter, lighter and can put more barrel on an LV. That"s all. Its an opinion, I stated if it was me, today that's where I would put my penny's. Unless a Viper DP happened to come along!

MAC

goodgrouper
12-31-2012, 01:24 PM
I applaud the fact that another person has gotten into the action building game. That being said, why would you by a Panda copy instead of a Panda?

David


I'm not Marty but I'd probably do the same thing he said. Mostly just because I know Dr. Marsh and he is one of the nicest folks you could ever meet. He's helped me several times out of the goodness of his heart. That goes a long way with me.
Sure, he's making a Panda-like action, but so is Stiller right? Nobody blames him for copying anymore. And Doc is making a version that Kelbly's didn't want to do anyway.
Besides that, my last Panda was far from expectations.....................:(

macflyboy
12-31-2012, 08:21 PM
Goodgrouper,

If I could talk you into coming to Sac you could meet Gabe > super guy and great shooter. Hope your keeping warm in Utah!

MAC

gabe ledesma
01-01-2013, 02:31 AM
Goodgrouper,

If I could talk you into coming to Sac you could meet Gabe > super guy and great shooter. Hope your keeping warm in Utah!

MAC

Marty, whats going on AMIGO,thanks for the kind words. What i should of mentioned in the beginning of the post is that i already have a stock for this new action that i plan on getting. Its a terry Leonard stock,but it is maid and bedded for a panda action RB-LP-RE. Yes i know that a stiller action will fit,i am going to give stiller a call . I dont really know to much about the marsh actions yet, i thought that the marsh action was a little shorter than a panda?. Gabe

macflyboy
01-01-2013, 10:52 PM
Gabe,

I think they will both fit your stock. Maybe awhile before you can get a Viper DP, but you never know.
See you soon. Call Doc Marsh he's a great guy. Don't mention my name or he might charge you double!

MAC

Boyd Allen
01-02-2013, 01:46 AM
http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2012/07/new-saguaro-compact-br-action-from-marsh-industries-llc/

Charles E
01-02-2013, 07:54 PM
Best I could tell from a real quick read of that 6mmbr.com press release, while the March action will take Panda barrels, it doesn't have a Panda footprint.

Dunno about you, but the Panda is one of my favorite actions. If Jerry Stiller is so busy doing work for Raytheon (they pay him ridiculous amounts) & there are no drop-ports in the foreseeable future, given your stock, I'd snap up a Panda in a hurry.

I guess they have them with ejectors now. Mine doesn't have an ejector, but the loading port is so long you can put in a new round & pluck out the fired case in one hand motion. Pretty darn quick, once you've done it a few times.

JerrySharrett
01-03-2013, 06:06 AM
I guess they have them with ejectors now. Mine doesn't have an ejector, but the loading port is so long you can put in a new round & pluck out the fired case in one hand motion. Pretty darn quick, once you've done it a few times.

Charles, given the confusion and unreliability of most all ejectors, I feel that if shooters would learn this load&grab method a lot of ejector actions would go the way of catapults.