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View Full Version : Bore Gel solvent or gel suggestions



Roy Allain
04-16-2012, 10:45 AM
I've been using Shooter's Choice Black Powder Gel mixed with Butch's Bore Shine to clean my barrels. Several other friends use the same
or with Shooter's Choice cleaner. Unfortunately, it is no longer made.

Can anyone suggest a gel replacement or can anyone suggest a gel mixture that I can make that will do the job?

Many Thanks.

Roy

lpreddick
04-16-2012, 01:01 PM
the word "gel" caught my attention. i homebrew things and recently made a "gel" to clean the baked on carbon from the grooves, specifically, of my varmint rifles's barrels. i have mixed jb bore paste with ammonia cleaning solution bought at home supply store. it takes awhile for the jb to start to cloud the ammonia solution and i let it sit overnight. it GELS! . i dilute it until the thickness is such that it just squirts from the 4 oz plastic bottles i bought from sinclair. a little learning curve to get the consistency. after cleaning with cleaning solvent , i run patches of this stuff down the bore and BLACK smears appear consistent with the 4 grooves of my kreigers. short stroking gets even more out and in a little while, the patches are clean. left some overnight on a piece of stainless barrel and no harm noted. i do not know the chemistry here but can see the results. borescoping afterwards reveals a very clean bore.

Don
04-16-2012, 07:09 PM
I've been using Shooter's Choice Black Powder Gel mixed with Butch's Bore Shine to clean my barrels. Several other friends use the same
or with Shooter's Choice cleaner. Unfortunately, it is no longer made.

Can anyone suggest a gel replacement or can anyone suggest a gel mixture that I can make that will do the job?

Many Thanks.

Roy

I believe LANOLIN, found in most drug stores, is the base compound in most gel bore cleaning products, so just add LANOLIN base to your favorite liquid bore cleaner until its the gel consistency that you are looking for..........Don

Vern
04-16-2012, 09:14 PM
Roy this is like dejavu.
There was a thread last year just like this. I am not sure who started it but I remember talking back and forth with Gene Beggs.
I went out online and found him a replacement.
I think it is called Agar.....
You can also see it mixed on Youtube.
I tried to do the search for the thread using gel but the stupid search engine does not recognize words less than 4 letters.
If you dont find the thread let me know and Ill try and look back through my posts.
But it was the same exact question.

jlcprec
04-16-2012, 11:10 PM
CVA makes a black powder cleaning gel. They call it Barrel Blaster. I have some mixed 50/50 with Kroil to try, which I haven't done yet.

Jim Carstensen

Vern
04-17-2012, 09:04 AM
Roy here is the link to the one I was thinking of.
AND as I found out you were the originator of the post.
Easy and quick to make and it works with solvents.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENdtgbrJwYM

eggman
04-17-2012, 09:53 AM
I have used a mixture of 3 parts Hoppe's #9 and 1 part Hoppe's Black Powder Solvent . When mixed the two solvents form a gel that works quite well for getting the "coal" out of barrel.

Rodney

HovisKM
04-17-2012, 10:36 AM
Dawn dish soap works well at the right ratio.

Hovis

Roy Allain
04-17-2012, 02:47 PM
Roy this is like dejavu.
There was a thread last year just like this. I am not sure who started it but I remember talking back and forth with Gene Beggs.

Thanks for the reminder Vern. I had completely forgotten about it. CRS.

I will get back to you and all the others asap. I'm waiting on a call back from G96.

Will also contact CVA. Where can I get Guar Gum. Wrigley's?

I'll also try the Hoppe's Black Powder solvent. If it's a gel it should work.

Will post again soon as I get something positive. I promise.

Roy

eggman
04-17-2012, 04:29 PM
The Hoppe's Black Powder Solvent is not a get until it is mixed with the regular Hoppe's #9 then it turns into a gel and actually gets thicker over time.
Just wanted to make sure if I wasn't clear on what I posted before .

Good luck,
Rodney

John Kielly
04-17-2012, 06:24 PM
... actually gets thicker over time.
Sounds like an uncle of mine.

It's always been my impression that cleaners with a bit of viscosity to them do the job better than the really watery ones, which is possibly why Sweets still has followers. Is that because they adhere to the whole diameter of the bore more consistently?

On the other hand, I have been really comfortable with the decoking power of Subaru upper engine cleaner on a black bristle brush.

John

eggman
04-17-2012, 10:21 PM
I incorrectly listed the Hoppe's mixture in my earlier post . I had it backwards . It is :
Mix 2/3 rds. Hoppes No. 9 Plus Black Powder solvent with 1/3rd. Regular Hoppes No. 9 Nitro solvent. Let this mixture set overnight and it will form a sort of gel that adheres very well to the brush and cuts powder fouling to a minimum.
This was copied from Speedy's Barrel Cleaning article on another forum.

Sorry 'bout that,
Rodney

Vern
04-18-2012, 11:25 AM
Roy I just went to ebay and queried it.
Quite a few suppliers seems about 8 oz or so for about $4.
Here is one link
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Guar-Gum-Powder-Now-Foods-8oz-Powder-/180848523899?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a1b697a7b#ht_862wt_975
Its also listed on Amazon and a lot of other places.
It is classified as a Food.

moore
04-19-2012, 11:47 AM
Hoppes makes a gel for cleaning modern rifles,check it out ,,it works good for me and I dont have to mix or make anything and take a chance on damageing something with a home brew.....

Roy Allain
04-19-2012, 02:32 PM
Thanks Vern.

Fyi. I contacted g96 yesterday and they told me they discontinued the Black Powder Gel to go with a mil spec cleaner.

I'm going to look into the Hoppes stuff and see what's happening.

Later -- as more info comes in.

Roy

Roy Allain
04-19-2012, 02:39 PM
I wonder what would happen if I mix the Hoppes Elite Gel with Montana Copper Killer. That looks like a winner. If it don't kill me.

lpreddick
05-07-2012, 09:18 AM
wanted to try eggman's mixture, but no hoppe's black powder cleaner. did get t/c equivalent and it works GREAT!. the blend of the t/c and hoppe's no 9 smells wonderful! almost want to put it on ice cream! joking aside, this mixture can be made to any thickness and gets the baked on carbon out without brushing or jb. learn something new everyday.

Roy Allain
05-07-2012, 10:50 AM
I bought a tube of CVA Barrel Blaster gelled solvent. Cost 12.95 plus 5.00 shipping. Never again.

I found out that it is made by Blue Wonder Products. I went to their web site and found it is 9.99 per tube.

Go figure. Still costs a 5.00 shipping charge.

When I get some time I'm going to try the lanolin. I have a tube I was going to try for case sizing, but I rather Imperial die wax. Why fix it if'n it ain't broke.

Roy

Roy Allain
05-07-2012, 10:51 AM
wanted to try eggman's mixture, but no hoppe's black powder cleaner. did get t/c equivalent and it works GREAT!. the blend of the t/c and hoppe's no 9 smells wonderful! almost want to put it on ice cream! joking aside, this mixture can be made to any thickness and gets the baked on carbon out without brushing or jb. learn something new everyday.

Is t/c Thompson Contender?

Roy

Roy Allain
05-07-2012, 10:54 AM
the word "gel" caught my attention. i homebrew things and recently made a "gel" to clean the baked on carbon from the grooves, specifically, of my varmint rifles's barrels. i have mixed jb bore paste with ammonia cleaning solution bought at home supply store.

What to name to look for or is it a generic cleaner?

Roy

Vern
05-07-2012, 03:34 PM
No brushing?
Gotta hear more about that.

lpreddick
05-08-2012, 09:22 AM
my jb and ammonia mix (ammonia comes in large plastic bottle...?1/2 gal, lemon scented) is thinned with the ammonia until is comes out of the 4 oz squirt bottles and will get the baked on carbon out with just pushing the patch thru. if, however, you stroke the patch the jb will get black out even if the bore is spotlessly clean, just like it does if used as a paste. the t/c (thompson center) mixed with hoppe's no 9 forms a greenish gel that is also thinned and WILL NOT get black out unless it is baked on carbon. short stroking with this stuff cuts the carbon very quickly! i rubbed a stainless piece of barrel with both gels and noted the difference. i borescope before and after during the cleaning process and noted the changes. i have made several homemade cleaners out of very flammable and toxic chemicals and have to ventilate my shop, but the stuff is safe and smells great! thanks.

Roy Allain
05-08-2012, 03:16 PM
I went to the hospital today for an Ultra Sound of my heart. I asked the tech about the gel used for the probe. He gave me a 1/4 full bottle. It looks like it might do the job, but I'm waiting for a reply from the mfg. before going further.

Now here is a brainstorm I had coming back from the lab. Hold onto the laughter and keep the obscene comments to yourself. "K-Y" jelly.;) It's a gel and may work, but no necessarily on stainless steel. And it's cheap. Bwaaa haaa haaa.

Roy

Vern
05-09-2012, 05:23 AM
Roy I was thinking about that very thing this morning. I started to post it but then thought better of it.
I knew some one would post something about maybe using K-Y instead of Molly,,,,,,

Roy Allain
05-12-2012, 02:11 PM
Roy I was thinking about that very thing this morning. I started to post it but then thought better of it.
I knew some one would post something about maybe using K-Y instead of Molly,,,,,,

I tried the k-y lookalike. I don't think it will work. I forms an emulsion that looks like milk and it's not very gel like. I'm not putting that stuff in my rifle bores. Never.

Roy

Roy Allain
05-21-2012, 11:56 AM
Does anyone know of or use Blue Wonder Cleaning Gel? I bought a tube and it looks to be pretty much like Shooters Choice Muzzleloader Gel. It gels my BBS the same and it is $3.00 cheaper than "Barrel Blaster" gel which is made by Blue Wonder Gun Care Products.

.357Mag
05-21-2012, 12:52 PM
Roy -

Howdy !

You're probably gonna get a hundred-million different answers.

I myself in-turn, progressed form use of Hopper's #9 and Hoppe's BP Sovent, to use of Sweet's ( briefly ), then on to use of Shooter's Choice, next came Butche's Bore Shine.

In more recent years, I have settled on use of Tom Meredith's " TM Solution ", for my precision rifle bore's. I've been able to clean my last 2 barrels w/o having to use a bore brush.

For my Ballard-rifled Marlin M-336 XLR, I have been plum amazed by the effectiveness of Gunslick "Foaming Bore Ceaner". THis stuff gets down into the corners of the grooves well. On the XLR, I am able to clean the bore w/o use of a brush ( jacketed bullets ) !

No matter what the solvent, I follow w/ a patch wet w/ Montana Extreme " Bore Conditioners ", and make sure to shoot one fouler before going for record. Works for me.


With regards,
.357Mag

ehparis
05-24-2012, 07:18 AM
I've been having good luck without a brush in using KG1 and KG2. When the copper fouling starts to build up a little I switch to KG12 and let it soak overnight with great results. I like the whole KG product line and recommend it.

lpreddick
05-31-2012, 09:43 AM
a followup: the t/c with hoppe's no. 9 continues to work. i am using it now after bore coating several guns...factory and custom stainless. read about bore coating with a product made by Dynamic Finishes Company, DynaTek coatings. the ?solution contains .25 micron sized ceramic particles in a solvent. per instructions, you patch stroke the bore several times, let dry overnight, then "cure" by firing several rounds...the heat and pressure set the ceramic particles in the bore steel... .25 microns is VERY small, so the bore dia is not affected. this is not witchcraft. i have coated 7 guns, 4 factory, known to be pita to clean. 4-7 patches of the above gel and the carbon is gone! borescoping confirms this, otherwise i would not believe it. copper comes out in half the time previously required. the carbon ring comes out with a nylon brush and the gel..before i had to spin a brush and solvent multiple times. i donot enjoy cleaning barrels but now i am sold on these two combinations.

Roy Allain
08-07-2012, 12:16 PM
OK guys, I'm back on to the gels, again.

I'm picking up a bottle of Hoppe's Elite Gel and a bottle of M-pro 7 bore gel tomorrow. Ordered from Brownells. If one or the other works as good as the Shooters Choice, my problem is solved. However, I'm not giving up on cooking my own.

I think I have found the chemical which gels all the solvents. It's "Diethelylene Glycol Monobuytl Ether". Just saying it within 3 feet of a bottle of BBs makes it gel.:rolleyes:

However, I need to find a chemist in the wasteland of Greater New Orleans area. Lol on that. We have a Dow Chemical plant up river (Mississippi that is) which is supposed to make it, but I just haven't had the time to go any further yet.

I'll be in touch.

Roy

Boyd Allen
08-07-2012, 12:28 PM
http://www.pharmco-prod.com/pages/MSDS/Diethylene_Glycol_Monobutyl_Ether.pdf

Gene Beggs
08-07-2012, 01:20 PM
OK guys, I'm back on to the gels, again.

I'm picking up a bottle of Hoppe's Elite Gel and a bottle of M-pro 7 bore gel tomorrow. Ordered from Brownells. If one or the other works as good as the Shooters Choice, my problem is solved. However, I'm not giving up on cooking my own.

I think I have found the chemical which gels all the solvents. It's "Diethelylene Glycol Monobuytl Ether". Just saying it within 3 feet of a bottle of BBs makes it gel.:rolleyes:

However, I need to find a chemist in the wasteland of Greater New Orleans area. Lol on that. We have a Dow Chemical plant up river (Mississippi that is) which is supposed to make it, but I just haven't had the time to go any further yet.

I'll be in touch.

Roy



Roy, glad you stayed with the hunt until you found what we have been looking for. Hope it proves to be the answer.

I'm glad to know there are others who really miss the Shooter's Choice black powder gel that we used to thicken our brushing solution. I don't think most shooters realize what an advantage it is to have a thicker mixture that clings to the brush and barrel surface and doesn't all run out the bore before it can do its job.

Keep us posted on this.

Gene Beggs

Gene Beggs
08-07-2012, 01:26 PM
http://www.pharmco-prod.com/pages/MSDS/Diethylene_Glycol_Monobutyl_Ether.pdf



Boyd, thanks for providing the product information sheet on the gell stuff. Sounds like it's a fairly user friendly product. I'm looking forward to hearing more from Roy. Hope you don't have to buy it in 55 gal drums. :rolleyes:

Gene Beggs

Gene Beggs
08-09-2012, 11:03 PM
Hey Roy

What's the latest on the gel stuff? Can't wait to get to the bottom of this.

Gene Beggs

mark-x
08-09-2012, 11:29 PM
has anyone tried the montana copper cream? I bought some thinking it would be like a gel copper remover. well it's like a white cream kind of reminds of a liquid car wax.
well i never seem to have a copper issue but i do have a barrel that is fire cracked in the throat and it is very hard to clean the carbon out of it, so bad that its hard to get a patch started in the bore.so i dont like this copper cream stuff it's very messy and dries up fast but i found that it removes the hard powder fouling in the throat better than anything i have ever used, i hate to use it, i mean it's messy but it does make short work of powder fouling in the throat,can't really say how well it removes copper.
http://www.montanaxtreme.com/products/?id=8&product=CopperCream

Gene Beggs
08-10-2012, 12:34 AM
has anyone tried the montana copper cream? I bought some thinking it would be like a gel copper remover. well it's like a white cream kind of reminds of a liquid car wax.
well i never seem to have a copper issue but i do have a barrel that is fire cracked in the throat and it is very hard to clean the carbon out of it, so bad that its hard to get a patch started in the bore.so i dont like this copper cream stuff it's very messy and dries up fast but i found that it removes the hard powder fouling in the throat better than anything i have ever used, i hate to use it, i mean it's messy but it does make short work of powder fouling in the throat,can't really say how well it removes copper.
http://www.montanaxtreme.com/products/?id=8&product=CopperCream



If the barrel is so fire cracked in the throat, it's hard to get a patch started, sounds like you need to replace that barrel. :eek:

What kind of rifle is it?

Stainless or chrome moly?

What caliber?

How many rounds down it?

Do you have a borescope?