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bozo699
03-03-2010, 01:34 AM
Hey Guys,
I took your last advice kept my old press and purchased new loading dies,good advice my groups have improved now I want to update my trimmer.I have a rcbs and I don't feel that its doing a precise job.I have been looking @ a wilson trimmer what do you think?

John Kielly
03-03-2010, 02:50 AM
I like my Wilson for its multifunctionality. Apart from trimming, the inside neck chamfering head is the most logical & easy to use of all the slow taper tools IMHO, and I can meplat trim on it too with my Whidden adaptor.

If you have the bucks, splash out on the micrometer.

LHSmith
03-03-2010, 07:52 AM
Ditto on the Wilson. I don't like the idea of a pilot spinning willy-nilly in the neck, and with those designs I always had trouble withdrawing the mandrel from the case due to the burr created on the inside of the neck.

Dennis Sorensen
03-03-2010, 09:03 AM
The old Forester trimmer trims accurately.

abintx
03-03-2010, 09:19 AM
Hey Guys,
I took your last advice kept my old press and purchased new loading dies,good advice my groups have improved now I want to update my trimmer.I have a rcbs and I don't feel that its doing a precise job.I have been looking @ a wilson trimmer what do you think?

A trimmer is a trimmer. How it's set up is the important thing. I've set my RCBS up to trim my 6PPC cases to 1.500 inches and that is what I get time after time [on the rare occasions that I have to trim]. I'd stick with what you have. Make sure yours is adjusted and tightened properly to give you precisely what you need. :)

dpapadimitrio@g
03-03-2010, 09:30 AM
If you trim multiple calibers (rifle) and also pistol the Wilson trimmer is the way to go. As suggested prior, the micrometer attachment is nice if you trim multiple calibers. Good way for neck chamfering as well.

Sinclair Int'l has some nice accessories (trimmer mount) and "shark" hold down for case holders. One thing you may need is they have holders for fired and unfired brass, in some cases you will need both, dependant on your specific chamber. Good to have a polypro block to tap the cases into and out of the holders.

Set-up is simple and easy, results are repeatable and consistent. Great simple tool.

mks
03-03-2010, 10:15 AM
Hey Guys,
I took your last advice kept my old press and purchased new loading dies,good advice my groups have improved now I want to update my trimmer.I have a rcbs and I don't feel that its doing a precise job.I have been looking @ a wilson trimmer what do you think?

I have always been uneasy about how consistent the inside and outside chamfering process can be when done by hand. I got one of the new Forster cutters that does trimming and inside and outside chamfering all in one step. It is faster and seems more consistent. Whether it actually improves accuracy, I can't say yet.

Cheers,
Keith

PS: Here's a video of it in operation: http://accurateshooter.wordpress.com/2010/01/21/

El Paso Mark
03-03-2010, 04:32 PM
I was going to go with a Redding but I don't like the way you insert the case and the way it's held. Have decided on the Sinclair/Wilson Ultimate instead:

http://www.sinclairintl.com/product/5497/Case-Trimmers

Cheers,

Mark

bozo699
03-04-2010, 03:16 AM
A trimmer is a trimmer. How it's set up is the important thing. I've set my RCBS up to trim my 6PPC cases to 1.500 inches and that is what I get time after time [on the rare occasions that I have to trim]. I'd stick with what you have. Make sure yours is adjusted and tightened properly to give you precisely what you need. :)

abintx,
you are probably right I probably don't have it set right,maybe you or someone could enlighten me.I have the manual style rcbs and the electric model they should both be the same I think? anyway Here is how I use it ,Install correct shell holder plate-install correct pilot -generally then I put a resized case that isnt up to specs(so if I ruin it-its not a good one) in shell holder-then loosen adjusting stop and slide it all the way back-put a small amount of lube on pilot and cutter-then slide pilot into case(after I monkey around getting case lined up to pilot)-then I cut a small amount off and check repeat if necessary untill it is close to length-then slide stop back and lock it down and use fine adjust utill case is at desired length.However every time I pull pilot out of case the case is in a slight bind,if you are taking quite a bit of brass off the bind and or missalignment is more severe.In my way of thinking if the case is not in EXACT alignment with cutter ie in a bind, then it cant possibly be cutting neck PERFECTLY square. which I would think would effect accuracy?

P.S I am not being a smartalic just trying to learn and make better loads Please advise if my prcedure is incorrect. Thanks.
Wayne.

abintx
03-04-2010, 09:33 AM
abintx,
you are probably right I probably don't have it set right,maybe you or someone could enlighten me.I have the manual style rcbs and the electric model they should both be the same I think? anyway Here is how I use it ,Install correct shell holder plate-install correct pilot -generally then I put a resized case that isnt up to specs(so if I ruin it-its not a good one) in shell holder-then loosen adjusting stop and slide it all the way back-put a small amount of lube on pilot and cutter-then slide pilot into case(after I monkey around getting case lined up to pilot)-then I cut a small amount off and check repeat if necessary untill it is close to length-then slide stop back and lock it down and use fine adjust utill case is at desired length.However every time I pull pilot out of case the case is in a slight bind,if you are taking quite a bit of brass off the bind and or missalignment is more severe.In my way of thinking if the case is not in EXACT alignment with cutter ie in a bind, then it cant possibly be cutting neck PERFECTLY square. which I would think would effect accuracy?

P.S I am not being a smartalic just trying to learn and make better loads Please advise if my prcedure is incorrect. Thanks.
Wayne.

I had the manual trimmer that I converted to the electric. It sounds like you've set it up properly to give you the right length. The area I would concentrate on is in placing the case head into the SHELL HOLDER. Sometimes, I have to ensure that it is holding the case properly. An area you might also look at are the case necks. Depending on the type of brass you are using, the necks may not be straight to start with. You might run the necks through a K&M Neck Expander Tool [with the mandrel for your caliber], to ensure they're straight to begin with. Finally there is always the possibility that the cutter itself or the trimmer is out of alignment.

The one thing nice about RCBS is that they stand by their equipment 100%. If you explain the problem to them, and they determine the cause of the problem is the tool they will send you a new trimmer. FOR FREE. One last thing. Whenever I have problems with a piece of equipment I always give the Tech Reps a call to go over the use of the equipment. There have been times when once I did that, I was able to make better use of the tool. Hope this helps Art :)

bozo699
03-04-2010, 03:28 PM
I had the manual trimmer that I converted to the electric. It sounds like you've set it up properly to give you the right length. The area I would concentrate on is in placing the case head into the SHELL HOLDER. Sometimes, I have to ensure that it is holding the case properly. An area you might also look at are the case necks. Depending on the type of brass you are using, the necks may not be straight to start with. You might run the necks through a K&M Neck Expander Tool [with the mandrel for your caliber], to ensure they're straight to begin with. Finally there is always the possibility that the cutter itself or the trimmer is out of alignment.

The one thing nice about RCBS is that they stand by their equipment 100%. If you explain the problem to them, and they determine the cause of the problem is the tool they will send you a new trimmer. FOR FREE. One last thing. Whenever I have problems with a piece of equipment I always give the Tech Reps a call to go over the use of the equipment. There have been times when once I did that, I was able to make better use of the tool. Hope this helps Art :)

Art,
Thanks for the help on this,I work for ATK which is the mother Co.of rcbs I will give them a call and I will call sinclair and purchase a neck expander.I sure would rather spend my money on somthing besides another new trimmer.
Again many thanks.
Wayne

WILDCATER
03-05-2010, 10:16 PM
A trimmer is a trimmer. How it's set up is the important thing. I've set my RCBS up to trim my 6PPC cases to 1.500 inches and that is what I get time after time [on the rare occasions that I have to trim]. I'd stick with what you have. Make sure yours is adjusted and tightened properly to give you precisely what you need. :)

And I suppose a rifle is a rifle?? They all go bang! Do yourself a favor and buy the Wilson!! I have used the RCBS and the Forester, they are in the same mindset that a trimmer is a trimmer, but nowhere in the the perfectly square cutting class as the Wilson, Id pop for the Sinclair/Wilson with the micrometer and assure you that when it comes to this trimmer and the others I have mentioned there is a HUGE DIFFERENCE!

Dennis Sorensen
03-05-2010, 10:27 PM
a trimmer is a trimmer, but nowhere in the perfectly square cutting class as the Wilson

I would be interested in an explanation on how you determine this.

How does one measure the square cut of the Wilson and how does one measure the square cut of the Forester? What do you compare?

John Kielly
03-05-2010, 11:31 PM
Dennis,

In my time, I've used Forster, Hornady, RCBS & Wilson trimmers, as well as those cute little calibre specific dies with glass hard tops that RCBS sold back in the sixties. Each of the first three had design elements that caused me to move on. The stepped collets on the Forster & RCBS & the shell holder on the Hornady all permitted the case to be held off axial alignment, as I often found when running the case neck on the cutter mandrel. Whether that was the reason or not, I at times found that the cutter would cut with one side & burnish a flare with the other. The Hornady cutter seemed to be the most aggressive & businesslike & I probably would still have it save that its case locking method didn't permit primed cases to be trimmed with any confidence, on those occasions when haste overcame organisation.

The Wilson system seems to me to be the less likely to result in misalignment of the case & thus avoid the possibility of cutting the neck out of square while I use close tolerance chamberings. However, I haven't run any measurements - hey, its not an issue to me. The guts of it is that I am confident in the performance of the multifunctional Wilson system, particularly that darling little inside neck chamfering cutter.

John

bozo699
03-06-2010, 07:34 AM
Do you have to have case holders for new and shot brass with wilson?Or do you just buy say 243 case holder and it is good for .308 family or what?

nhkuehl
03-06-2010, 08:37 AM
I have an RCBS rotary trimmer, but I mostly use the Lee case trimmers with a pilot gage and feel they work just fine (repeatable), but they aren't adjustable or available for all calibers or the smaller flash hole cases. I would prefer to trim to maximum length rather than minimum length. They are inexpensive and don't take up room on your bench and are a good way to start out or if can't $pend much on equipment. nhk

abintx
03-06-2010, 09:43 AM
trimmers are like rifles, you get what you pay for! And I suppose a rifle is a rifle?? They all go bang! Do yourself a favor and buy the Wilson!! I have used the RCBS and the Forester, they are in the same mindset that a trimmer is a trimmer, but nowhere in the the perfectly square cutting class as the Wilson, Id pop for the Sinclair/Wilson with the micrometer and assure you that when it comes to this trimmer and the others I have mentioned there is a HUGE DIFFERENCE!

How much of a difference did you detect on the target that the Sinclair/Wilson trimmers made over the others mentioned?

How significant did your groups shrink as a result of their use?

That's where the proof of the proverbial pudding is and I would suggest that there is not enough difference to make any difference whatsoever.

Has anyone done a scientific test to see how much difference one side of a case that's off by say .0009" inch makes on target? Art :)

John Kielly
03-06-2010, 05:21 PM
Do you have to have case holders for new and shot brass with wilson?Or do you just buy say 243 case holder and it is good for .308 family or what?
I only load the .308 in that case family, but I don't trim my Lapua brass until after first firing when the case is formed to my chamber. The one time I did trim cases first, I found varying case lengths once fired. I guss that's understandable when you consider how brass is formed.

The shot die works OK to do a little break on the neck with the chamfer cutter for first loading. The necks are all round & consistent as I expand them up with a K & M .303 turning expander then prep them on the Lee collet die first. They get a trim & full prep after that furst firing.

gt40
03-07-2010, 10:04 AM
I have the RCBS trimmer and use their 3-way cutters. :):):)

Take a look here: http://www.midwayusa.com/browse/BrowseProducts.aspx?pageNum=1&tabId=1&categoryId=19913&categoryString=9315***731***695***8935***

"Aim small miss small", :D

gt40

Scroll down they are all on the same page:

RCBS Trim Pro Case Trimmer 3-Way Cutter 6mm :)
Product #: 132686
Status: Available
Average Customer Rating:
5 stars
Our Price: $42.99


RCBS Trim Pro Case Trimmer 3-Way Cutter 30 Caliber :)
Product #: 251948
Status: Available
Average Customer Rating: 5 stars
Our Price: $42.99


RCBS Trim Pro Case Trimmer 3-Way Pilot and Chamfer 30 Caliber :)
Product #: 451559
Status: Out of Stock, Backorder OK
Our Price: $11.29