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mdknudsen
03-15-2009, 12:32 PM
Some of my buddys are putting together a for fun once a week 100yrd br shoot. Looking for input on cartrige and rifle ,I will not be hand loading at first anyway. Heres what I was thinking 22 250 or 204 and savage bvss or cz varmint. I am open to any ones input thanks mike

ADVAUTO5488
03-15-2009, 01:02 PM
some of my buddys are putting together a for fun once a week 100yrd br shoot. Looking for input on cartrige and rifle ,i will not be hand loading at first anyway. Heres what i was thinking 22 250 or 204 and savage bvss or cz varmint. I am open to any ones input thanks mike

i own many savages and all of them shoot great, they are easy to change barrels, calibers, etc. As for a caliber, i have a savage 12fv 22/250 that shoots ragged holes but has more recoil than my 223 and 204. The 223 and 204 shoot just as good, less recoil. My 22/250 that shoots ragged holes does it with the white box winchester, 40 pack 45gr hollow points, this factory ammo shoots as good as any reload i have. You cant go wrong with a savage, good luck

SGJennings
03-15-2009, 01:07 PM
One idea:

Call Bob White at http://www.benchrest.com/shooterscorner/ and ask about a proven rifle in .222 Remington.

caroby
03-16-2009, 10:17 AM
Savage BVSS or VLP or LRPV in a 1-9" .223 ... Bed it nice and tight with no stress and go WIN... I vote the VLP...

Nice dose of 4895 or Varget and a 60gr Berger or Sierra 69gr MK seated .005 off the lands.

When the factory barrel gets tired, order a Lothar Walther .223 1-12" and shoot ITTY BITTY...! Same can be said with a Shilen or PacNor or..... Pre-fit Sav barrel.

Have fun...!
cale

jackie schmidt
03-16-2009, 10:41 AM
Will you be shooting group, or score??......jackie

mdknudsen
03-16-2009, 06:59 PM
All the details are not worked out yet, but I was thinking group but I am not in charge I am going to try and get them to do 22 rimfire 50yds if I can. thanks mike

jackie schmidt
03-16-2009, 07:45 PM
Since you indicated in your first post that this was for 'fun", let me suggest that you choose to shoot Score, instead of Group.

The simple fact is, shooting group without moving backers is worthless, as far as the competition goes. Sure, you will have a good time, and the fun aspect is always present.

But also present is the fact that even though we are all honorable men, there is no way to certify a group unless you have a way to prove how many shots a shooter shoots.

I know this sounds crass, but I see it far too many times how, at club matches, (where backers are not used), there are "zeros", and "teen aggs" recorded. But, when it comes time to shoot a Registered Match, many of these shooters can't make two bullets touch. Or, they don't even bother to show up.

At Tomball, we shoot big time Benchrest, in that we have two Registered Group Matches that are attended by some of the best in the Country.

We also have a Club Match program where we shoot Score. The Competition is just as tough, and the scores can easilly be proved. Nobody has to go home with an ill feeling about one of his "buddies' might not having put the correct number of shots in a group.

OK, everybody, FLAME AWAY. How dare me suggest that there are shooters who would rather win something that be completely honest.


But I have said it before, and I will say it again. Shooting Group Competition without a moving backer is a useless endevour. I suppose you can do it, but just don't call it 'competition'.

Solve the problem by shooting score. The challenge is the same, and it lends its self to the "shoot for fun' format much better. Whether we admitt it or not, the word "Match" designates competition. when you compete, you want it to mean something. With score, there is no doubt that your accomplishment is for real........jackie

TomD
03-16-2009, 08:29 PM
I dunno, I shot my 2nd match in a year last weekend and you could tell for sure that I shot 5 times per relay. Sigh---

OH yeah original point: score or group get a Savage in .223.

Bill Wynne
03-16-2009, 08:51 PM
I know this sounds crass, but I see it far too many times how, at club matches, (where backers are not used), there are "zeros", and "teen aggs" recorded. But, when it comes time to shoot a Registered Match, many of these shooters can't make two bullets touch. Or, they don't even bother to show up.

OK, everybody, FLAME AWAY. How dare me suggest that there are shooters who would rather win something that be completely honest.

jackie

Jackie! Whatever are you trying to say? These are benchrest shooters we are speaking of not fishermen or golfers. :)

Concho Bill

Don
03-16-2009, 08:58 PM
Since you indicated in your first post that this was for 'fun", let me suggest that you choose to shoot Score, instead of Group.

The simple fact is, shooting group without moving backers is worthless, as far as the competition goes. Sure, you will have a good time, and the fun aspect is always present.

But also present is the fact that even though we are all honorable men, there is no way to certify a group unless you have a way to prove how many shots a shooter shoots.

I know this sounds crass, but I see it far too many times how, at club matches, (where backers are not used), there are "zeros", and "teen aggs" recorded. But, when it comes time to shoot a Registered Match, many of these shooters can't make two bullets touch. Or, they don't even bother to show up.

At Tomball, we shoot big time Benchrest, in that we have two Registered Group Matches that are attended by some of the best in the Country.

We also have a Club Match program where we shoot Score. The Competition is just as tough, and the scores can easilly be proved. Nobody has to go home with an ill feeling about one of his "buddies' might not having put the correct number of shots in a group.

OK, everybody, FLAME AWAY. How dare me suggest that there are shooters who would rather win something that be completely honest.


But I have said it before, and I will say it again. Shooting Group Competition without a moving backer is a useless endevour. I suppose you can do it, but just don't call it 'competition'.

Solve the problem by shooting score. The challenge is the same, and it lends its self to the "shoot for fun' format much better. Whether we admitt it or not, the word "Match" designates competition. when you compete, you want it to mean something. With score, there is no doubt that your accomplishment is for real........jackie


Hi Jackie,

Actually, a form of "group" matches can be shot, without backers, using a bull record target similar to the newly started PSL rimfire money matches.

One shot each is fired at the 5 separate record targets. A measurement, to the 3rd decimal point, .001, is taken of the shot furthest from the center bull middle aimpoint, and is recorded as the target group measurement.

This came up while discussing "string" measurements/competitions awhile back on this messageboard.

In a sense, this marrys certain aspects of both "group" and "score", without the need for backers, while giving the outcome in a decimal measurement format, that could be closely compared to a standard 5 shot group competition, and without worry of mysterious missing shots..............................Don

ADVAUTO5488
03-16-2009, 09:17 PM
Since you indicated in your first post that this was for 'fun", let me suggest that you choose to shoot Score, instead of Group.

The simple fact is, shooting group without moving backers is worthless, as far as the competition goes. Sure, you will have a good time, and the fun aspect is always present.

But also present is the fact that even though we are all honorable men, there is no way to certify a group unless you have a way to prove how many shots a shooter shoots.

I know this sounds crass, but I see it far too many times how, at club matches, (where backers are not used), there are "zeros", and "teen aggs" recorded. But, when it comes time to shoot a Registered Match, many of these shooters can't make two bullets touch. Or, they don't even bother to show up.

At Tomball, we shoot big time Benchrest, in that we have two Registered Group Matches that are attended by some of the best in the Country.

We also have a Club Match program where we shoot Score. The Competition is just as tough, and the scores can easilly be proved. Nobody has to go home with an ill feeling about one of his "buddies' might not having put the correct number of shots in a group.

OK, everybody, FLAME AWAY. How dare me suggest that there are shooters who would rather win something that be completely honest.


But I have said it before, and I will say it again. Shooting Group Competition without a moving backer is a useless endevour. I suppose you can do it, but just don't call it 'competition'.

Solve the problem by shooting score. The challenge is the same, and it lends its self to the "shoot for fun' format much better. Whether we admitt it or not, the word "Match" designates competition. when you compete, you want it to mean something. With score, there is no doubt that your accomplishment is for real........jackie



This is the reason you want a savage. No body questions one hole groups with a savage. LOL

mdknudsen
03-18-2009, 06:51 PM
My main question was what cal and what rifle, this is for fun so I dont want to spend to much money under 1000.00 dollars.

Gerry
03-18-2009, 07:08 PM
This is easy'
Get your favorite brand of rifle {factory} in 223 remington.
Later if you want to get into handloading the 223 will be the easiest to find loads for. The caliber is excellent only taking a back seat to the 222.
The rifles can be the new Savage varmint or the Remington 700 varmint.
that depends on your budget. There are also other rifles Winchester , Sako etc that are around in that caliber.
Above all have fun.
It's good to see someone starting out with something other then a full blown out bench rifle. A lot of people forgot HUNTER CLASS STARTED THIS WAY.

tobybradshaw
03-18-2009, 07:09 PM
My main question was what cal and what rifle, this is for fun so I dont want to spend to much money under 1000.00 dollars.

If you keep your eyes open you can probably pick up a Rem 700 or XP100-based BR rifle (in a real BR stock), most likely in 6PPC, and possibly with a pretty good trigger, for under $1K. Besides the 6PPC, any of the popular short-range cartridges for which Lapua makes brass would also work: .222, .223, .22 PPC, .22 BR, 6BR. The PPCs will require some case forming from .220 Russian, but even the fireforming loads can be used for practice since they're usually pretty accurate at 100yd.

Toby Bradshaw
baywingdb@comcast.net

ScottD
03-18-2009, 07:34 PM
I agree - a Savage in .223 or 6BR is the ticket. At least it is the ticket until someone else brings a full blown Benchrest Rifle - don't worry it will happen.

As far as moving backers are concerned....

The Eastern Benchrest Shooters Association was formed in 1947. Moving backers were in use in Dubois by 1950 maybe earlier. (referenced in The Ultimate in Rifle Precision 1951 Bench Rest Shooter's Annual Townsend Whelen , Editor.


It didn't take long - even back then to figure that out.

jaberegg
03-18-2009, 07:45 PM
Mike, give me a call. I live in Scottville an we have just the match ya'all are looking for in Harrison once a month, both group an score. You boys bring your factory stuff an you will be in a class with only factory guns. You will meet a bunch of great people an have fun besides learning a thing or two on how to make a factory gun shoot. However, if your going to shoot locally here in town give me a call, would love to join you.

Jeff Aberegg
231 936 1099