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View Full Version : Where did those International Match threads go?



Joe Haller
02-05-2009, 10:42 AM
Deleted . . . But: I got'a get in on this . . .

Seems a lot of us Americans benchrest shooters have an "emotional" attachment to the targets we shoot on. We just ain't gona give up the target we have learned to love.

NRA had that problem years ago, and solved it.

For many years us Americans shot smallbore prone & position matches on the "official" NRA targets. To accommodate our shooters who wanted to prepare for Olympic competition NRA had International targets printed up. Clubs that wanted to run International type matches were then able to do so on official ISU targets.

Not sure just when NRA made these International targets available, but when I started shooting Smallbore in 1958 we were able to order International 50 & 100 meter target. They even had International targets printed with reduced ring sizes for 50 yards & 100 yards. That was for clubs that did not have moveable target frames.

So what happened? Clubs had new options. Did it hurt match attendance? Not at our club! Back in 1967 NRA asked for local clubs to sponsor Preliminary Olympic Tryouts for the 1968 Olympic Games. Winners of these matches would be invited to the final tryouts at the Black Canyon Range, North of Phoenix Arizona. (It is now called the Ben Avery Range). Our club volunteered to sponsor a Preliminary Tryout. Back then we would have an average of about 25 shooters at our prone outdoor matches. We decided to run our tryout for the Olympic English Match, which is 60 shots Prone at 50 meters. Our local Olympic tryout drew a crowd of 75 shooters. Not bad for a club in a town with a population of 15,000 people at the end on no-where on the Canadian border.

From my experience: Us North American guys might consider accepting an European target for International rimfire benchrest matches here in the USA.

BUT: I mentioned those "emotional" attachments. I am one of those who have a favorite target, and I have a very strong attachment to it! The European target is too easy. The IR-50/50 target is too easy. The RBA target is too easy. Even the inside out ARA and Australian worst edge targets are too easy. Yea: And Dan's new PSL target is too easy too.

The UKBR22 guys shoot at 25 & 50 yards/meters. Their target is too easy too. The best target for that course of fire is the USBR target. TOUGH at 50 yards/meters and not easy at 25 yards/meters either.

BUt: My preference for the USBR target is just "emotional". Or it it?

Joe Haller (Mr. Frosty)

Carlo Caricato
02-05-2009, 02:04 PM
please tell me more.

Peter Armstrong
02-05-2009, 02:14 PM
Carlo,

You need to ask Andy, it was his thread.

Peter

Carlo Caricato
02-05-2009, 02:27 PM
dear bear,
I had not asked the question to you...
when I will want to do it him I will do. don't doubt!
...turn on your brain before speaking... memoirs?

Peter Armstrong
02-05-2009, 02:37 PM
Carlo,
Unlike yourself I'm not a mind reader.
If you don't say what you are talking about or to who you are talking too, most will think you are talking abut the subject of the thread which is in this case is Where did those International Match Threads Go?

Carlo Caricato
02-05-2009, 03:01 PM
I don't understand why has to intervene by himself a third part to a specific question to one other. peter! leave that joe is the only able to answer my question if he wish. please.
cheers again

Joe Haller
02-05-2009, 07:44 PM
I guess Andy could tell us about his deleted thread. Not sure he could tell us about the USBR target. He could probably tell us something about the Olympic Prone English Match. But . . . I think, Carlo, you were asking about the USBR target, and why I prefer it over all the other rimfire BR targets.

Right?

I use to be a Smallbore Prone Shooter. Then, I got into centerfire Benchrest. Then, I got out of centerfire benchrest before a I lost ALL my hearing.

About 12 years ago I wrote for targets and rules books from all the US rimifire Associations. I belonged to a club in Michigan and one in Texas. I wanted to get them started in rimfire BR and needed information on all the options before making a decision on which Association to join.

I liked the USBR target best, because it was the most difficult, and because it was the easiest to score. The 8 ring being a different color, made it easier to identify values of the different rings. And it was easiest to identify an X, because if you see any "green" of the .10" ten ring under the scoring gauge, it is not an X. Much easier than trying to determine if the shot touches the X dot.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v186/Joe_Haller/Targets/NEWTargetDiscription.jpg

This graphic shows how an X is scored on the USBR Target: The target has been enlarged to show detail best.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v186/Joe_Haller/Targets/Scoring1.jpg

The ARA target is tough. The USBR target is tougher. For matches at 25 yards the USBR target works well for us. Use of the other targets at 25 yards/meters would not be a good choice. A 250-25x at 50 yards/meters on the USBR target is only a dream at this time.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v186/Joe_Haller/Targets/ARA-USBR-IR.jpg

Besides the target issue, there are the rules. I knew that NONE of the Associations rules could attract our local shooters.. Being "into" benchrest match organization for the past 50 years, running sanctioned NBRSA centerfire matches, and "home brew" local club matches for both centerfire and rimfire: My experience told me that none of the National Association rules would attract new shooters to our local clubs matches.

The rules of each of our National Associations (in my opinion) are what has led to average match attendance of LESS than 10 competitors at Sanctioned Rimfire Matches in the USA.

I came up with a set of rules that attracted NEW shooters and decided to use the USBR target. I set up the "On-Line" Matches over on Rimfire Central back on 2001, using those rules. Here in BRC they call me an "Outlaw".

Joe Haller (Mr. Frosty)