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Locoweed
11-18-2008, 08:18 AM
Does anyone know anything about "fire cracking" in the throat or bore of rifles caused by using bore cleaners containing a lot of ammonia, such as Sweets 7.62 cleaner?

Rich In Kansas
11-18-2008, 10:21 AM
I wish I could help. That info has been around since at least the early 90's, probably longer. I used some bore cleaner then called GOZON I believe, that was heavy with ammonia. I remember several telling me not to use it, but I have never seen any test in a reputable gun magazine that proves it one way or the other. I would think if there was any truth to it the rumor would have took wings and the manufacturers would have stopped using ammonia. Rich

KEN HARPER
11-18-2008, 11:04 AM
I don't use ammonia based bore cleaners and my center fire rifles still suffer from fire cracking. I think its just the result of heat and extreme pressure.

sonny
11-18-2008, 07:56 PM
Try puting some ammonia base clearner on the outside of the barrel, let it set for some time and go back latter and inspect the area you put the ammonia cleaner on and judge for yourself. I think you will have a better ideal of what you are doing to the inside of your barrel good or bad ?Your choice

tim
11-18-2008, 09:55 PM
That will not actually prove anything. It has been long known that amonia based solvents can often react with any number of things inside a barrel, in particular 416 stainless and pit a bore if left too long.

xxgrampa
11-19-2008, 01:18 AM
greetings all

ammonia has a big down side and a small upside. with all the other cleaners out there i just don't use it. no sense in taking a chance.

..ttfn..grampa..

Mad`
11-19-2008, 08:51 AM
So many wives tales. Ken Harper has it right about the centerfire fire cracking, ( I call it heat checking). This will happen to a 6PPC barrel in less than 100 rounds, but the barrel keeps shooting good till about 1500 rounds.

I have never seen it in a rimfire. The bottom of rimfire barrels get sandblasted, but that's another story.

Borescope: A wonderful invention.

Big Al
11-19-2008, 11:10 AM
Does anyone know anything about "fire cracking" in the throat or bore of rifles caused by using bore cleaners containing a lot of ammonia, such as Sweets 7.62 cleaner?

I didn't know you rimfire guys shot copper jacketed bullet? The only reason for the use of ammonia in a rifle barrel is to remove copper fouling.:confused:

Boss Hoss 540
11-19-2008, 11:45 AM
I didn't know you rimfire guys shot copper jacketed bullet? The only reason for the use of ammonia in a rifle barrel is to remove copper fouling.:confused:

:D:D:D:D:D Thought the same thing myself. Cleaning solvents are a tool just like anything else---have to use the right one for the job at hand. A screwdriver is not very handy when you need a wrench..;)

langenc
11-19-2008, 12:09 PM
Try some GUNZILLA-no ammonia and aqueous(no smell).

Mad`
11-19-2008, 12:50 PM
Somewhere in this thread, centerfire was mentioned and so the ammonia. Your right though, no need to use ammonia in a rimfire unless your are shooting CCI Mini-Mags. :p

The biggest killer to rimfires besides improper cleaning is the primer compound.

xxgrampa
11-19-2008, 01:24 PM
hey mad, i like that face..:p:p:p:p:p:p:p:p:p:p

kinda makes a person want to smile.:p:p:p help, i can't stop..

..:pttfn.. grampa:p:p..

tim
11-19-2008, 05:22 PM
I'd guess because the post was put over on the CF forum, doing it here might have been in error especially since it really is used mainly for copper.

Locoweed
11-19-2008, 08:22 PM
.17 HMR is a rimfire with a FMJ. I posted the question on both centerfire and rimfire forums for maximum exposure.

pacecil
11-20-2008, 10:20 AM
This is one of those things started by a some one with a little bit of knowledge. Ammonia can cause problems in metals used in chemical processes at high temperatures and pressures. It will promote corrosion and weakness in grain boundaries of steel and some other metals. The hydrogen and nitrogen in ammonia may also cause brittleness under certain conditions. It generally needs the presence of oxygen (water) and maybe even a catalyst to be a problem, but it nearly always requires high temperature, pressure, and time. Ammonia is only slightly likely to ever cause a problem in a gun.

Mad`
11-20-2008, 10:43 AM
I've always used a pretty harsh ammonia bore cleaner (Montana Extreme) in my 6PPC Shilen barrels. Never had a problem. As a matter of fact, I never got a blue patch from a Shilen match centerfire barrel.
Dale McClure

tim
11-20-2008, 10:12 PM
Gee Cecil, you might want to drift on over to Jim Borden's web site, it has plenty of information on amonia in match barrels with lots of cautionary stuff about the history of misuse and damage. But hey he's only one of the best BR smiths on the planet. By the way... he's even an engineer.:eek: