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Yote
08-19-2008, 03:19 PM
Heard early this morning that a school district in Texas will be letting teachers carry guns to their classes. The teachers will have to be certified to carry and any that wish to, can.

I know there are two sides to every scenario, but I kinda like the idea. Think about it, why are schools such an easy target?

Think of the outcome if professors and/or students could carry at Va. Tech?

What say you??

(Hope this can be discussed without political implications.....)

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080815/ts_nm/texas_guns_dc

BUSHMASTER1
08-19-2008, 04:23 PM
I would feel better if my kid's teachers were armed. I went to the same school in Pearl, MS., where Luke Woodham went on his rampage. He was stopped because a teacher retreived his gun from a vehicle. This would not be legal now.

Mr. D
08-19-2008, 05:02 PM
As a retired teacher I would have had a gun, but the training and selection would have to be good to avoid problems. Not everyone could be relied on to be safe in such a situation. It is tough enough on cops to know when to shoot and when to negotiate. It might be better to have only a few with good training on campus that would be willing to be called into quick action before police could arrive. Hard decision!

Bill Wynne
08-19-2008, 05:13 PM
I think that an explanation of where this school is is in order.

Harrold, Texas is a small farming community right up against the Red River and Oklahoma. It is about 17 miles SE of Vernon, the county seat, and about 33 miles NE of Wichita Falls.

The school has about 117 students in grades K thru 12. This place is not Dallas or Houston and it is a long way from either. The superintendent probably knows all the teachers well and the students and their families also.

I am sure they did not expect all this attention.

This might not work out in a big city school district but I see no problem with this case.

Concho Bill

langenc
08-19-2008, 06:08 PM
Size should not make a difference-unless bigger schools are in GREATER need of armed personnel.

A gun dont start going off cause you take it to school, church or the county fair if it dont go off anywhere else. That is the idea that so many have a hard time getting their teeth into.

Yote
08-19-2008, 07:11 PM
As a teacher, I do like the idea, especially the way the school I teach at is laid out. It's completely open, spread out over about 10 acres with no fence. Anyone wanting to come on campus has free reign from mulitple entry points. It's rediculous, a prime target for someone to drive up with a load of weapons. Several of us have voiced that but it's fallen on deaf ears.

Having a firearm even in my vehicle which is parked right outside the shop I teach in would be reassurance should the unthinkable happen. We do have a resource officer but he's in and out covering a couple of the city schools. I wouldn't want to put my life in his hands.

I'm all for it............

brad541thb
08-19-2008, 07:32 PM
I was shocked to here that. For one, schools are treated about like airports. I honestly can't believe they went through with it. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying I was against it, just shocked that a school administration would allow their teachers to actually carry guns. I doubt that every teacher will have a pistol though. I hope they know when and if to use them. But it beats being sitting ducks in a classroom if hell breaks loose.

B. Harvey
08-19-2008, 07:53 PM
When I was in high school, at any given time, 20% of the guys had either a shotgun, rifle or bow in their car on school grounds. Most of us were in one of the teams and even had plenty of ammo for practice after school.

Our school never had a problem like some do now involving firearms.

But, there were quite a few fist fight that took place at the church beside the school, at 3:05 pm.

speedpro
08-19-2008, 07:58 PM
Some how I just can"t picture Miss Landers or Miss Crump with a gun in their purse. Miss Rayburn yes. The only "terrorist" we ever had to be concerned with was a few, very few kid's who threw rocks and may break the school windows, they even had the curiosity to wait till school let out !

vinny
08-19-2008, 10:00 PM
As a teacher/Administrator I would love to carry one. I agree with D, the training or licensing process would have to be pretty intense because I know some teachers I wouldn't trust with a water pistol!
vinny

Mr. D
08-19-2008, 11:57 PM
I've met some gun people I would trust with a water pistol! :eek:

Bill Wynne
08-20-2008, 04:53 AM
I agree with Vinny and D. I would trust myself but not everyone with a gun at work. Most of us do not have jobs with the same kind of stress with people like teachers have.

I am wondering if the few times that there have been terrible events involving gun shootings at schools justify actions like this.

I think that we would see things like teacher parent conferences go bad. We all have seen teachers who were frustrated and even afraid of some of the kids. You might say that problems like these that might lead to gun violence would be very rare like one in a million. Let me suggest that there are millions of students and millions of teachers and there are many stressful confrontations each day across our country and many more in the course of a school year.

I will not be going into places where I think I will need a side arm.

Concho Bill

longshooter
08-20-2008, 08:28 AM
I read an article a few days ago on this, if I remember correctly, there was concern about their close proximity to a highway, so I suppose vulnerability, like, enter, hit, and run is on their minds. And also, there was mention of specialized training, I think so that they're all on the same page.

Perhaps they have occasional occurances that cause concern.

phantom496
08-20-2008, 08:37 AM
I will not be going into places where I think I will need a side arm.

Not to change the subject, but do you ever go to the show, or out to eat, go shopping ? With the atmosphere in the world the way it is today, I never leave home without mine. In my state you can get a conceled carry license and it has eliminated a lot of the problems we once had. They don't know who is carrying . . .:D Makes the bad guys think twice before trying to carjack..

Phantom

Louis Boyd
08-20-2008, 08:45 AM
After seeing this I thought about each of the teachers I had from 1st grade through getting a degree in college. There were only four of them that I though had enough common sense that I'd want them carrying to "protect me". None that I'm aware of had any gun handling skills.

And what keeps a teacher from going nuts and shooting up the classroom? The worst school massacre in US history was committed by a member of the school board of the school he blew up with multiple bombs.
http://www.migunowners.org/forum/showthread.php?p=192163
Armed teachers woiuld not have stopped that.

In my opinion at least for colleges allowing students and teaches who have had appropriate training and have obtained permits to carry makes sense, though it won't stop all incidents. Mass murder won't necessarily be stopped even if all of the potential victims are armed. As with the case in 1927 the murderer wanted to commit suicide and take a bunch of people with him. That's hard to stop. Being insane doensn't mean a person is stupid. Someone intent on mass murder can find a way.

An undesirable side effect of the Texas law will be to make the teacher the first target if a crazed murderer enters a classroom, whether they're carrying or not. I doubt that will help teacher recruitment.

There is a cost to having a free society where citizens aern't restrained from peaceful activities because they might do shomething evil but are approprately punishing when they do commit evil. That's how our Federal government was set up, but it's degraded over the years by pllacing more and more restrictions on everyone. On rare occasions that cost is high because someone just doesn't care if they're punished or even die when they commit evil. Is it worth that cost to have a free society? I believe it is.

beemanbeme
08-20-2008, 03:02 PM
It's an abstract thought but how many 7-11's would NOT have been robbed if the thieves had not known the clerks were unarmed and told to not resist? How many of these schools would NOT have been terrorized if the perps had known their grand stand play was gonna be short and terminal.

Yote
08-20-2008, 03:31 PM
After seeing this I thought about each of the teachers I had from 1st grade through getting a degree in college. There were only four of them that I though had enough common sense that I'd want them carrying to "protect me". None that I'm aware of had any gun handling skills.

And what keeps a teacher from going nuts and shooting up the classroom? The worst school massacre in US history was committed by a member of the school board of the school he blew up with multiple bombs.
http://www.migunowners.org/forum/showthread.php?p=192163
Armed teachers woiuld not have stopped that.

In my opinion at least for colleges allowing students and teaches who have had appropriate training and have obtained permits to carry makes sense, though it won't stop all incidents. Mass murder won't necessarily be stopped even if all of the potential victims are armed. As with the case in 1927 the murderer wanted to commit suicide and take a bunch of people with him. That's hard to stop. Being insane doensn't mean a person is stupid. Someone intent on mass murder can find a way.

An undesirable side effect of the Texas law will be to make the teacher the first target if a crazed murderer enters a classroom, whether they're carrying or not. I doubt that will help teacher recruitment.

There is a cost to having a free society where citizens aern't restrained from peaceful activities because they might do shomething evil but are approprately punishing when they do commit evil. That's how our Federal government was set up, but it's degraded over the years by pllacing more and more restrictions on everyone. On rare occasions that cost is high because someone just doesn't care if they're punished or even die when they commit evil. Is it worth that cost to have a free society? I believe it is.

Good points, Louis, but a teacher in most cases will already be the first target. If I were an outraged gunmen intent on death and destruction, my first target would be the one that would pose the biggest threat to my carrying out my plan which would be the adult in the room.

I agree that an individual will carry out his plan at all costs and more than likely will succeed to some point. Guns in teachers hands will at least hopefully keep that to a minimum instead of everyone just being sheep waiting to be slaughtered. I'll take armed teachers over having no chance at all. If nothing else, a couple of teachers can hopefully keep a gunmen pinned down till LE can arrive on scene.

Bill Wynne
08-20-2008, 04:56 PM
It is a shame that we even have to talk about this. The best thing would be for no one out side of the faculty to know who is packing so it might be everyone.

Concho Bill