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koginam
06-27-2008, 01:59 PM
I have just been listing to Obama's speech with hillery he is promising to punish the oil companies for making money by taxing them more.
Please someone explain to me the difference between the government adding a tax of say 10% on gas at the pump and taxing the oil companies !0% on what they sell. either way its the consumer that is paying for it. Is he & his advisers to stupid to understand that or do they feel the American public is to stupid to figure it out?

Phil Deese
06-27-2008, 02:11 PM
I think most of them that were around cheering were to stupid to understand!!! Companies don't pay taxes there passed on to the consumer....you and I realize that, but most that are ignorant of the system don't.

Chuck Bogardus
06-27-2008, 02:20 PM
A lot of other folks don't realize that if a company makes a 7% profit on investment, that's pretty much okay. And that's what their stockholders want. And if that investment is in the multi-billions of dollars, then that 7% is going to be a considerable number.

Maybe the major owners oughta just quit worrying about making a profit, sell out, close down, and buy an island paradise or three.

How many of y'all have horses?

tome
06-27-2008, 07:30 PM
taxing oil company profits really worked well for jimmy carter

TomD
06-27-2008, 07:39 PM
His energy "policy" is a disaster, tax and regulation of all existing sources and a prohibition on all new sources. If I tried to come up with a disastrously wrong policy, I would would be hard pressed to to top his.

We are doomed. This guy is going to win and his policies are disastrous.

Phil Deese
06-27-2008, 07:40 PM
Jimmy was.............and still is..............a NUT!!:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Phil Deese
06-27-2008, 07:43 PM
Don't give-up yet!! The votes haven't been counted, and all the "DIRT" hasn't been plowed yet on the muslim!!

Old Timer
06-27-2008, 08:24 PM
TomD

10 years back my wife worked at a power plant (Indiana Michigan power and light) (I&M) They laid off 50% of the work force. My wife was in that 50%
When they announced the layoff they said it was because of de-regulation of the power industry. They said this was all started by Mr.Reagan and we would be feeling the effects far into the future.

Now Electricity and natural gas go up every year, not like it was back in the 70's
Just a little ditty I have experience with :(

Mr. D
06-27-2008, 08:27 PM
Don't give-up yet!! The votes haven't been counted, and all the "DIRT" hasn't been plowed yet on the muslim!!

Phil,

I won't give up yet! No matter what kind of cheap shot remarks you make like this one, I'm going to try to not give up on you!

As to you sticking up for the poor oil companies and their tax breaks note the following:

The U.S. Energy Information Administration's most recent analysis of the oil industry's performance, released just last month, showed oil industry return on equity of 27 percent—about 10 points higher than that of other manufacturers. And it has been higher throughout this recent era of high world oil prices, just as it was back during the oil shock that hit in 1980.

I wish you and I could get a 27% return on our investment and also get a tax break from the government! (10% higher than the average of most industries!)

Phil Deese
06-27-2008, 09:25 PM
I have found out you and I agree on a great many things...........................Obama isn't one of them!!

I still think he will be bad for the country, and I still believe he has very stong muslim ties, which could help destroy our country. 20 years of Rev. wrong hasn't helped his case, in addition to one of the most liberal voting records in the senate.

Mr. D
06-27-2008, 09:29 PM
Phil,

Reread post #9 above your last one!

I'll give you the liberal voting record part! He's still not as liberal as Bush! :D

koginam
06-28-2008, 03:24 AM
Ok they made 27% Profit that's their job, it still doesn't explain my original question,
let me ask another one, How is raising the tax on the oil companies going to bring down the cost? Or will it cause the cost to go up?

RePete
06-28-2008, 06:39 AM
He may think that he's taxing the oil companies, but in reality he's just taxing the lowly worker. The price of oil products will rise - again.

Mr. D
06-28-2008, 09:17 AM
He may think that he's taxing the oil companies, but in reality he's just taxing the lowly worker. The price of oil products will rise - again.

I think that depends on how smartly the legislation is written. You are assuming no one is smart enough to write legislation that will prevent the passing on of the tax! Such laws were written and enforced during WW II when there were shortages. Those who took advantage of a shortage by bleeding their fellow countrymen could wind up in jail.

When gasoline prices are causing families such extreme hardships we don't need Exxon Mobil making a 27% return on their blood money. If I was president :eek: not being bought off by the oil lobby and OPEC, I might ask Mexico, Venezuela and others if they wanted to ship gasoline and diesel to the U.S. at 40% less and let Global Trade work for us for a change! It might get Exxon Mobil's attention when independent dealers started pumping gas at $2.50 a gallon as they do in Mexico! Who says I have to buy from Bush's buddies in the Saud family and OPEC with a gun to my head so he can make 27% plus even more money in the futures market. I'm all for the greedy god of capitalism until he pulls down my pants and bends me over! If I lived in San Diego I get an 150 gal tank and take my diesel pickup across the border and save about $385. every trip plus picking up the exactly same medications for half the price! Can't you tell when we are getting screwed by those good, patriotic, religious conservatives you all love always talking about family values??? Going broke is a family value too! :confused:

If U.S. oil, gas, minerals, water belong to the people of the U.S., requiring it serves our needs first is a socialistic idea worth thinking about! Our national resources belong to us, not Bush's oil fat cat buddies. Check the prices in OPEC and Latin American countries that have oil!!! They don't throw it all on the open market and for the highest profit of private greed and bleed their citizens into a depression! That's the way we roll in the capitalism of the U.S.

rstreich
06-28-2008, 11:31 AM
Check the prices in OPEC and Latin American countries that have oil!!! They don't throw it all on the open market and for the highest profit of private greed and bleed their citizens into a depression! That's the way we roll in the capitalism of the U.S.

And just look at what thriving and vibrant economies those countries have. :eek:

gt40
06-28-2008, 01:14 PM
What would inspire another country to sell oil to the US for 40% less than the world market price?

Maybe we could give Venezuela's dictator or the head of the Mexican drug cartel that runs Mexico a couple of nice ties and a couple dozen socks?

gt40

RStiefel
06-28-2008, 01:21 PM
we start consuming less fuel here in our own country, our own dwindling economy is on a road to ruins.

Mr. D
06-28-2008, 01:34 PM
What would inspire another country to sell oil to the US for 40% less than the world market price?

Maybe we could give Venezuela's dictator or the head of the Mexican drug cartel that runs Mexico a couple of nice ties and a couple dozen socks?

gt40 Without the massive greed involved Venezuela and Mexico has already attempted to do so, but Bush will have none of it! Wonder why? My local market doesn't like people selling fruit at half price in front of their store either!

koginam
06-28-2008, 07:37 PM
A few thousand gallons of fuel oil given to us by Venezuela was meant to embarrass us not to help.

Mr. D
06-28-2008, 10:00 PM
A few thousand gallons of fuel oil given to us by Venezuela was meant to embarrass us not to help.

You make it sound like they were going to send us 10 quarts of 10/30 weight! My understanding is Bush didn't want to oil to come from a Socialist Leader soon to be part of the Axis of Evil? Can I buy $2.70 diesel from Mexico or will I be investigated by Homeland Security?? :D

gt40
06-28-2008, 11:42 PM
Have you ever seen a Citco Station? They are owned by Chivez of Venezuela. I have family that live there and know what he has done to the only previously stable Democratic country in South America with the help of Jimmy Carter.

gt40

koginam
06-29-2008, 01:11 AM
Here this may help you to understand better.
From the wall street journal Nov/28/2006
http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/feature.html?id=110009310
Dial Joe-4-Chávez
Massachusetts Democrats love Venezuela's strongman.
Tuesday, November 28, 2006 12:01 a.m. EST

Venezuelan strongman Hugo Chávez is an ally of the Iranian mullahs, a supporter of North Korea, a close friend of Fidel Castro and a good customer for Vladimir Putin's weapon factories. Now he's also a business partner of Joseph P. Kennedy II.

The former Democratic Congressman describes the deal he's cooked up with Mr. Chávez as charity for low-income consumers of heating oil. But it's worth asking what the price of this largesse is to Venezuelans and to U.S. security interests.

The arrangement is this: Mr. Chávez's Citgo--a Houston-based oil company owned by the Venezuelan government--is supplying home heating oil to Mr. Kennedy's Citizens Energy Corporation at a 40% discount. Citizens, a nonprofit outfit, says it passes the savings onto the poor, aiming to help 400,000 homes in 16 states that would otherwise have trouble heating their homes. In the process, Mr. Kennedy happens to get a high-profile publicity plug. If you think you qualify, says the television ad that drew our attention to this partnership, just dial 1-877-Joe-4-Oil.





Generous Joe is not the only one polishing his public image here. In the mold of the Castro strategy of sending armies of "doctors" and "teachers" among the Latin American poor, Mr. Chávez is trying to shape U.S. public opinion in the hope that more gringos will come to see the Chávez government as benevolent.
Massachusetts Democrats seem especially eager to help. In a September 29, 2005, "confidential memorandum" addressed to "President Hugo Chávez" and uncovered by a Congressional committee, William Delahunt (D., Mass.) gushed that it was a "pleasure" to have met with the strongman "to discuss your generous offer." The Democrat advised Mr. Chávez to steer his oil through Mr. Kennedy's nonprofit and declared that "from a public relations perspective" the discount oil scheme "is an extraordinary opportunity to address urgent needs of people living in poverty, while showcasing the compassion of your nation."

Compassion? If fighting poverty is the goal, Mr. Delahunt would do better to remind Mr. Chávez that charity begins at home. The U.S. is far richer than Venezuela and since Hurricane Hugo took power in 1999 Venezuelan living standards have suffered despite soaring oil prices. Annual inflation averaged more than 20% between 2001 and 2005, imposing a tax on the poorest. Meanwhile, an insecure investment climate has taken a harsh toll on private-sector employment and shrunk the middle class.

In his eight years in power, Mr. Kennedy's business partner has also polarized Venezuela with his class warfare, rewritten the constitution, politicized the judiciary, the electoral council and military, and announced he plans to rule until 2021. Freedom House now ranks Venezuela 34th out of 35 countries in the Western Hemisphere in press freedom. Only the Cuban press is more repressed.

Transparency International puts Venezuela second to last in the Hemisphere in its 2006 "corruption perception index." And then there was that revealing rant against President Bush ("the devil") at the United Nations in September. Even Mr. Delahunt criticized his Venezuelan buddy after that one.





But Mr. Kennedy keeps on trucking. Last week in a telephone interview with the Washington Post, he defended his Chávez subsidy deal as "morally righteous," arguing that the Citgo contribution to his nonprofit is only "one-half of one percent" of Citgo oil and product sales in the U.S.
We dialed Joe-4-Oil ourselves to ask directly whether it is also "righteous" to assist an anti-American tyrant at the expense of the Venezuelan people. In between berating our reporter for daring to ask such a thing, Mr. Kennedy said that Mr. Chávez has done "so much more" for the poor than any previous government. As for democracy, he said there was "ample room for improvement in the ways that people get elected in Venezuela as well as in Florida." Mr. Chávez chose his partner well.