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View Full Version : RED ALERT! Beggs Cartridge, BIG PROBLEM!



Gene Beggs
01-07-2008, 03:03 PM
" SEE! I knew it wouldn't work! That Beggs guy,,, the very idea, trying to come up with something to compete with the PPC; nothing will ever compete with the PPC!!" :mad::mad:

Ha! Gotcha' again. :p:p Now if you were thinking along those lines when you saw this red alert, you will be disappointed, because the problem has already been taken care of. I tried to think of everything and was so sure I had everything perfect only to find that Murphy's law had bit me again:mad:

Just to give you a hint about what happened, I'll ask you a question, "What diameter are the drilled flash holes in a new Lapua 220 Russian case? Yep, that's right, .059 and they are beautifully done and should be left exactly as they are. So, what diameter decapping pin normally comes with a custom die from Hornady? Yep,,, .070:eek: Rat's!

Ben Syring from Hornady just called and said they were sorry they didn't catch that, but I reminded him it was my fault for not specifying the smaller pin, which they carry in stock. He checked with shipping and sure enough, the second batch of dies are on their way with .070 pins. We had a good laugh about how things work; when you hope it is shipped they never are, when you're hoping they haven''t,,,, sure enough, they went out this morning. Anyway, Ben Syring and Lonnie Hummel at Hornady have bent over backwards to help with this project and have done a marvelous job on the dies. Ben said he would send me the replacement pins and I'll mail them out to you.

I spoke with Jackie Schmidt earlier today; I'll let him tell you about his experiences with the 6mm Beggs. :D:D

Later,

Gene Beggs

shoot44
01-07-2008, 07:00 PM
Don't feel bad Gene, Wilson sent out sizer dies for the 6.5/6mm x 47 Lapua with the .070" decapping pin. The only brass available is Lapua. I guess everybody gets caught once in a while. Thanks for all your effort with the .220/6mm Beggs.
Greg

MColeman
01-07-2008, 07:05 PM
Gene: I just ordered a 6Beggs reamer today and now I have a question regarding dies. In my beginning days of reloading Hornady dies were really second class with RCBS being the best then. Now, I consider Redding to be the best and have not considered Hornady due to my 40 year prejudice against them.

Have they improved that much? Maybe I should have sent you a pm but I've opted out of the pm thing and don't really care for them. If you'd rather reply in private just e-mail me at benchrest5@wildblue.net. Thanks.

Chisolm
01-07-2008, 07:29 PM
Mickey
I know what you mean. 30 years ago my brother bought some Hornady dies so I could reload for him and they certainly were not as good as RCBS. That was 30 years ago and the new Hornady dies are nothing like they were back then, today I think they are better quality than the standard RCBS which is what I also started with.
Another reason for going with Hornady is that you will not find better guys to deal with on custom dies than Lonnie and Ben.
James

JSchopper
01-07-2008, 07:34 PM
" SEE! I knew it wouldn't work! That Beggs guy,,, the very idea, trying to come up with something to compete with the PPC; nothing will ever compete with the PPC!!" :mad::mad:

Ha! Gotcha' again. :p:p Now if you were thinking along those lines when you saw this red alert, you will be disappointed, because the problem has already been taken care of. I tried to think of everything and was so sure I had everything perfect only to find that Murphy's law had bit me again:mad:

Just to give you a hint about what happened, I'll ask you a question, "What diameter are the drilled flash holes in a new Lapua 220 Russian case? Yep, that's right, .059 and they are beautifully done and should be left exactly as they are. So, what diameter decapping pin normally comes with a custom die from Hornady? Yep,,, .070:eek: Rat's!

Ben Syring from Hornady just called and said they were sorry they didn't catch that, but I reminded him it was my fault for not specifying the smaller pin, which they carry in stock. He checked with shipping and sure enough, the second batch of dies are on their way with .070 pins. We had a good laugh about how things work; when you hope it is shipped they never are, when you're hoping they haven''t,,,, sure enough, they went out this morning. Anyway, Ben Syring and Lonnie Hummel at Hornady have bent over backwards to help with this project and have done a marvelous job on the dies. Ben said he would send me the replacement pins and I'll mail them out to you.

I spoke with Jackie Schmidt earlier today; I'll let him tell you about his experiences with the 6mm Beggs. :D:D

Later,

Gene Beggs

Gene:
Would you please email me...... cash1953@sbcglobal.net
Jeff

henrya
01-07-2008, 08:14 PM
Mickey,
The Hornady dies made nowadays have a really excellent interior finish. I like them better than anything I've seen from a big company.

Hornady does use a silly collet style decapper rod that I don't like but its not a deal breaker. You'll need a wrench to tighten it enough to use and it is needlessly complicated over a simple screw and nut.


Gene: I just ordered a 6Beggs reamer today and now I have a question regarding dies. In my beginning days of reloading Hornady dies were really second class with RCBS being the best then. Now, I consider Redding to be the best and have not considered Hornady due to my 40 year prejudice against them.

Have they improved that much? Maybe I should have sent you a pm but I've opted out of the pm thing and don't really care for them. If you'd rather reply in private just e-mail me at benchrest5@wildblue.net. Thanks.

bryan
01-07-2008, 08:19 PM
You never mentioned how you came out in your informal match this weekend.
Bryan

MColeman
01-07-2008, 09:06 PM
Mickey
I know what you mean. 30 years ago my brother bought some Hornady dies so I could reload for him and they certainly were not as good as RCBS. That was 30 years ago and the new Hornady dies are nothing like they were back then, today I think they are better quality than the standard RCBS which is what I also started with.
Another reason for going with Hornady is that you will not find better guys to deal with on custom dies than Lonnie and Ben.
James
Thanks for the feedback. I'm so sold on Redding dies that I'll prolly call them to see if they can furnish me a set. I've never seen better dies than Reddings.

ReedG
01-07-2008, 09:21 PM
Mickey:

Glad to see you "into" shooting again. I've missed ya!

The Hornady Match Dies are quite nice bushing dies and well finished. If they are the basis for the Beggs cartridges I do not think you will be disappointed.

Is your reamer for "no-turn" neck?

MColeman
01-07-2008, 09:58 PM
Mickey:

Glad to see you "into" shooting again. I've missed ya!

The Hornady Match Dies are quite nice bushing dies and well finished. If they are the basis for the Beggs cartridges I do not think you will be disappointed.

Is your reamer for "no-turn" neck?
Reed,
Yes, it is a .272 neck. I've been lurking but want to shoot a few matches this year. How have y'all been doing? Please give Leon my regards. If Redding is not set up to make the dies yet I may try Hornady based on your recommendation.
Blessings,
Mickey

Gene Beggs
01-07-2008, 10:00 PM
Gene: I just ordered a 6Beggs reamer today and now I have a question regarding dies. In my beginning days of reloading Hornady dies were really second class with RCBS being the best then. Now, I consider Redding to be the best and have not considered Hornady due to my 40 year prejudice against them.

Have they improved that much? Maybe I should have sent you a pm but I've opted out of the pm thing and don't really care for them. If you'd rather reply in private just e-mail me at benchrest5@wildblue.net. Thanks.

Hi Mickey, nice to hear from you.

I'm sorry you had problems earlier with Hornady, but if that was forty years ago, lots of things have changed since then. I have been using Hornady dies for years for my .223 prairie dog rifles. They work great; I could not be happier with them.

The reason I decided to go with Hornady for my custom 220/6mm Beggs dies was because of a nice write up on 6mmBR.com about Lonnie Hummel and the custom die department at Hornady. I called Lonnie and was very impressed with his knowlege and the way he took a personal interest in the project. My timing was bad because they were simply swamped with orders and doing their best to get new equipment on line, hire and train more technicians etc. Although I had to wait longer than anticipated, I must say, the wait was worth it; the dies are as perfect as anything could be.

Lonnie has been out for several weeks with some very serious back surgery but is back on his feet and will be back to work soon. In the meantime, Ben Syring in engineering/CAD has been taking Lonnie's calls and supervising the custom shop operation. He as been very helpful and has also taken a personal interest in the project. He plans to build his daughter a 25 caliber hunting rifle on the parent case. It should make a delightful little hunting rifle.

Mickster, I'll make you a deal you can't refuse. :cool: I'll send you one of these dies to try for thirty days, no charge. You chamber a barrel and ream out an existing 6ppc seater with the chamber reamer, and if after thirty days you don't feel it's the most accurate, easy to deal with system you have ever shot, just box it up and send it back. What do you say?

Please give my best regards to Dorothy.

Later,

Gene Beggs

Gene Beggs
01-07-2008, 10:17 PM
You never mentioned how you came out in your informal match this weekend.
Bryan

Bryan, I was wondering if anyone was paying attention. You weren't going to let me get away with that; were you?

Huckeba, Tucker, Conry, Gass and myself had a good time Saturday afternoon shooting in some horrendous winds. We started out in winds from one thirty at about twenty mph, increasing to about twenty five with gusts to thirty by mid afternoon. I didn't stay long; I think I shot only three groups at one hundred yards. One was a pretty nice group with all shots touching. The other two groups were my classic four in and one out, but everyone agreed the gun was shooting very well; as well as any of the 6ppc's. I was shooting the no-turn version, which I have grown to love. We will have yours ready soon.

Later,

GeneBeggs

MColeman
01-08-2008, 10:35 AM
Hi Mickey, nice to hear from you.

I'm sorry you had problems earlier with Hornady, but if that was forty years ago, lots of things have changed since then. I have been using Hornady dies for years for my .223 prairie dog rifles. They work great; I could not be happier with them.

The reason I decided to go with Hornady for my custom 220/6mm Beggs dies was because of a nice write up on 6mmBR.com about Lonnie Hummel and the custom die department at Hornady. I called Lonnie and was very impressed with his knowlege and the way he took a personal interest in the project. My timing was bad because they were simply swamped with orders and doing their best to get new equipment on line, hire and train more technicians etc. Although I had to wait longer than anticipated, I must say, the wait was worth it; the dies are as perfect as anything could be.

Lonnie has been out for several weeks with some very serious back surgery but is back on his feet and will be back to work soon. In the meantime, Ben Syring in engineering/CAD has been taking Lonnie's calls and supervising the custom shop operation. He as been very helpful and has also taken a personal interest in the project. He plans to build his daughter a 25 caliber hunting rifle on the parent case. It should make a delightful little hunting rifle.

Mickster, I'll make you a deal you can't refuse. :cool: I'll send you one of these dies to try for thirty days, no charge. You chamber a barrel and ream out an existing 6ppc seater with the chamber reamer, and if after thirty days you don't feel it's the most accurate, easy to deal with system you have ever shot, just box it up and send it back. What do you say?

Please give my best regards to Dorothy.

Later,

Gene Beggs
Gene, you're right. I can't turn that deal down. Send the die. You've confused me on one point, though. If a seater die is already a 6PPC how do you ream it out for a smaller case? Am I missing something here unless you're talking about the .272 neck????

Gene Beggs
01-08-2008, 10:50 AM
Gene, you're right. I can't turn that deal down. Send the die. You've confused me on one point, though. If a seater die is already a 6PPC how do you ream it out for a smaller case? Am I missing something here unless you're talking about the .272 neck????

Mickey, about the seater die, this is something that was not obvious to me at first. The Wilson type straight line seaters in 22 and 6mm ppc, which most of us use are the same diameter at the base, of course, because we use the same parent case, the Lapua 220 Russian. But they are too small in the neck to accept the no-turn versions of my cartridge. You simply run the chamber reamer into the die (you don't even need a pilot) and 'voila', you've got a perfect seater for YOUR chamber. The Beggs cartridge has more taper in the body and does not contact the chamber of the seater except at the base and neck, which is where the alignment comes from anyway. Some things are so simple we overlook them; eh? :D You know me; I'm always looking for a simpler, easier way to do things. :)

Later,

Gene Beggs

MColeman
01-08-2008, 08:00 PM
If you like simple things it's no wonder we hit it off right away. I'm like a lever---a simple tool. Thanks, Gene. ;)

RoyB
01-09-2008, 07:30 PM
about the seater die,

Are you saying to ream out a 220 Russian seater die rather than a 6PPC die?

Gene Beggs
01-09-2008, 09:32 PM
Are you saying to ream out a 220 Russian seater die rather than a 6PPC die?

Either one will work fine as long as bullet diameter is the same. For example, if you have a Wilson 6ppc seater die and are going to the 6mm Beggs no-turn with the .274 neck, all you have to do is run the chamber reamer into the die to enlarge the neck. If you are building a 220 Beggs, you will have to start with a 22 caliber seater in .222, .223, 220 Russian etc. Hope this answers your question.

Gene Beggs